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  • Shanghai Real Estate Bust

    Here are two interesting articles. The first article is about the Shanghai housing bust, about which I would be interested in hearing what mindseye, et al. have to say. The second article is about the DC area condo market cooling.

    The difference between the two markets is large. For instance, the Shanghai real estate market seems to be dominated by condos, while condos make up a modest part of the DC area real estate market (even though I own one and live in an area where condos dominate). Also, 30% down required in China is huge compared to 5% down required in the DC area.

    The China article...

    From the Los Angeles Times
    A Home Boom Busts
    Shanghai's hot housing market has fizzled after a run-up fed by speculators, threatening a significant part of China's economy.
    By Don Lee
    Times Staff Writer

    January 8, 2006

    SHANGHAI — American homeowners wondering what follows a housing bubble can look to China's largest city.

    Once one of the hottest markets in the world, sales of homes have virtually halted in some areas of Shanghai, prompting developers to slash prices and real estate brokerages to shutter thousands of offices.

    For the first time, homeowners here are learning what it means to have an upside-down mortgage — when the value of a home falls below the amount of debt on the property. Recent home buyers are suing to get their money back. Banks are fretting about a wave of default loans.

    "The entire industry is scaling back," said Mu Wijie, a regional manager at Century 21 China, who estimated that 3,000 brokerage offices had closed since spring. Real estate agents, whose phones wouldn't stop ringing a year ago, say their incomes have plunged by two-thirds.

    Shanghai's housing slump is only going to worsen and imperil a significant part of the Chinese economy, says Andy Xie, Morgan Stanley's chief Asia economist in Hong Kong.

    Although the city's 20 million residents represent less than 2% of China's population of 1.3 billion, Xie says, Shanghai accounts for an astounding 20% of the country's property value. About 1 million homes in Shanghai alone — about half the number of housing starts for the entire United States in 2004 — are under construction.

    "They'll remain empty for years," Xie said, adding that a jolting comedown also was in store for other Chinese cities with building booms — including Beijing, Chongqing and Chengdu — though other analysts say the problem is largely confined to Shanghai.

    Shanghai's housing bust comes after a doubling of prices in the previous three years, a run-up fueled by massive speculation. With China's economy booming and Shanghai at the center of worldwide attention, investors from Hong Kong, Taiwan and elsewhere were buying as fast as buildings were going up. At least 30% to 40% of homes sold were bought by speculators, says Zhang Zhijie, a real estate analyst at Soufun.com Academy, a research group in Shanghai.

    "Ordinary people had no option but to follow the trend," Zhang said. "Worrying that prices would be even more unaffordable tomorrow, many of them borrowed from relatives and banks to buy as soon as possible."

    The Shanghai government only pushed the market higher, he added. "Many of the officials said Shanghai's property market was healthy and wouldn't drop before the World Expo" in 2010.

    For Wang Suxian, the tale of two lines illustrates how the bubble has burst.

    When home prices were at the tail end of the boom in March, Wang hired two migrant workers to stand in line for a chance to buy units in what the developer said was modeled after an apartment community on New York's Park Avenue.

    The workers waited 72 hours, including cold nights, but the 35-year-old was thrilled to come away with two apartments, one for $110,000, about the average price for a new home in Shanghai, and another for $170,000. They were among Wang's four investment properties.

    And for a short period, Wang believed she was raking in hundreds of dollars a day for doing nothing, as property prices in the city kept soaring.

    But today, prices at the complex have fallen by a third, and the lines of frenzied buyers are gone. Wang is among dozens who are fighting the developer to take the apartments back.

    On a recent frosty morning, she stood in a line herself with about 40 other buyers outside the builder's headquarters, demanding that it negotiate a deal to return their money. "This is ridiculous," Wang huffed.

    The company, Da Hua Group, invited Wang and other homeowners inside, served them hot tea, then told them to forget it.

    "I think it'll take at least three years before the property market becomes healthy again," said Zhu Delin, a finance professor at Shanghai University and former head of the Shanghai Banking Assn.

    The typical home being built is in a high-rise complex, with two bedrooms and about 850 square feet of living space.

    Developers say many of Shanghai's homes are valued at about $70,000 or less, and price drops haven't been as steep for those units.

    Some still see promise in the Shanghai market. Incomes are rising and droves of people are relocating from the inner city to outlying areas, said Richard David, managing director at Macquarie Property Investment Banking China in Shanghai.

    What's more, he says, the Shanghai government — which owns all the land — has auctioned off few lots in the last two years, which will limit the number of housing units in the future.

    But that's little solace for homeowners who have seen inventories rise even as buyers show no hurry to come back into the market.

    In Shanghai, people blame the popping of the housing bubble on the central government, which has applied one measure after another in the last year to quash excessive speculation and price increases.

    Banks were ordered to raise their best rate on home loans to 5.5% from 5%. Home buyers were required to make down payments of at least 30%, up from 20%. A 5.5% capital gains tax on home sellers' profits was imposed. Beijing also levied a 5% tax on the sale price of homes sold before two years of ownership.

    "It's killed the speculators," said David Pitcher, a Shanghai developer and former head of CB Richard Ellis' office here.

    Before the market swooned, buses would bring investors from the southeastern coastal city of Wenzhou in Zhejiang Province on home-buying missions here. They no longer come.

    Wang, the woman battling Da Hua, is one of tens of thousands of Shanghai home buyers from Wenzhou, known for its wealth and business prowess.

    But it's not just speculators who have bailed out of the market. A lot of potential Shanghai buyers have been scared off by numerous reports of sinking home prices and desperate action by some owners.

    Internet chat rooms recently were abuzz with a story that a Taiwanese man had jumped from the 33rd floor of an apartment tower about 15 miles northeast of downtown. Many people suspect that he killed himself because he was drowning in debt after his home investments went sour.

    Managers at the complex refused to comment, but brokers indicated that the price of some units there have plummeted by more than 50% since March, when a home fetched as much as $250 a square foot, similar to housing prices in some Southern California communities.

    Zhang Wei, an editor at Imagine China, a photography agency in Shanghai, was close to buying an apartment in the new Pudong development area last year.

    The 25-year-old planned to use his $1,250 in savings, and his parents — a policeman and a doctor — agreed to contribute about $30,000. The family of three currently lives in a 550-square-foot apartment in an industrial district that was provided by his father's employer, the Police Bureau.

    Zhang walked away from the deal after the central government stepped up its campaign to cool Shanghai's market. He noticed prices beginning to drop. "When two of the four real estate agencies near our home finally closed, I decided not to buy for at least two years," he said. "Even a 1% drop in prices is a lot of money for us."

    For Shanghai, prolonged weakness in the housing market could be very painful. Like Los Angeles, Shanghai relies heavily on real estate to drive its economy. Morgan Stanley's Xie calculates that property sales directly accounted for about half of $31 billion of the growth in Shanghai's annual economic output from 2001 to 2004.

    Construction cranes still fill the skyline of Shanghai, an area of about 2,200 square miles — a little more than half the size of Los Angeles County. But there's sparse development in the center of the city, where strong sales of high-end homes and luxury office suites, in large part by foreigners, belie the losses around it.

    Shanghai's government is relocating inner-city residents to new suburban areas, where entire towns are going up as part of a plan to build distinct industries that ring the city.

    It's unclear how many of these new homes are sitting empty. Sales and inventory figures aren't provided by the government. But analysts say they can see the surplus of housing when they drive past housing complexes and there are few lights on at night.

    Few analysts are betting on a quick turnaround. Yin Zhongli, an economist at the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences in Beijing, says a housing crash takes time to clean up. He worries that the financial sector will be crippled by the real estate fallout. Last year, he said, 76% of all bank loans in Shanghai were in real estate.

    "Now is the time to swallow a bitter pill," Yin said.

    That's what Huang Xiaolei is doing. The 25-year-old Shanghai native nabbed a 1,700-square-foot apartment from Da Hua during the heady times last spring. The unit wouldn't be completed until the end of the year, but as is customary in China, Huang had to secure a loan and make the down payment right away.

    She and her parents pooled their life savings of about $80,000 and put 30% down on the $270,000 home. In April, they began making monthly mortgage payments of $1,100 on a 30-year loan with a 5.5% interest rate.

    In November, Huang decided to stop the monthly payment, and this month she filed a lawsuit against Da Hua, claiming her contract allowed her to rescind the purchase before the house was completed under special circumstances, with a 3% fee.

    "We have over 40 cases like this at our firm," said Du Yuping, Huang's lawyer.

    Huang regrets that she got caught up in the frenzied market, and says that even if she wins the lawsuit, she'll suffer a hard financial loss.

    "I was cheated," she said.
    I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

  • #2
    From the WaPo regarding the DC condo market...

    Area Condo Sales Cooling After Record-Setting Year
    Rise in Supply Gives Buyers a Break

    By Kirstin Downey
    Washington Post Staff Writer
    Saturday, January 7, 2006; A01

    Sales of new condominiums reached record levels in the Washington area in 2005, according to a new report, but the supply of new condos has begun to outstrip demand.

    That means that would-be condo buyers have many more choices than they had only months ago, according to local real estate agents. Melissa Chen, a real estate agent with District-based Evers & Co., said shoppers are touring as many as 40 units now before choosing, enjoying the luxury of time to consider their options. That's a big change from when there were only a handful of properties available and buyers had to snap them up with little time for reflection, she said.

    In 2005, 13,698 new condo units were sold in the area, up from 9,108 in 2004, according to the new report from Delta Associates, an Alexandria-based real estate information firm. Sales were particularly brisk in the fourth quarter of 2005, when 3,541 new condos were sold -- a record, according to the report -- up from 2,394 in the comparable quarter in 2004.

    But far more units are being readied for the market, either in new projects or conversions from rental apartments. About 51,400 units were being planned or marketed for delivery within the next three years, Delta Associates found, up from 39,000 three months earlier. It appears some builders are proceeding with projects they have spent years developing, even as the supply of new units rises, in hopes their projects will be more successful than the competition.

    "Even with sales at record highs, there is so much product being delivered that the market has a different feel to it," said Gregory H. Leisch, chief executive of Delta Associates.

    Leisch said many condo developers are proceeding because they must financially. "They paid so much for the land, and they are so far down the development timetable, they are so far committed, that, practically speaking, they can't stop," he said.

    "I think without question the condo market will continue to soften," said Kenneth Wenhold, Virginia and Maryland director for MetroStudy, a Houston-based real estate research firm that specializes in the new-home market. Wenhold said there are five times as many condo units for sale as there were a year ago.

    During the housing boom of the past five years, the Washington area market has been among the nation's hottest, with the market for condos particularly superheated.

    Condominiums, a form of dense, multi-family housing in which you own your own unit and a share of common areas, generally represent a lower-priced housing option. As single-family dwellings became very expensive during the boom, condos were especially attractive, even in suburban areas. And they were particularly popular with investors.

    While the inventory of all housing for sale in the Washington area has risen over the past few months, the change in the formerly hot condo sector has been the most marked.

    When the condo market was at its peak a year or so ago, investors flocked to buy units before construction with the intention of flipping them for a profit. Wenhold said he has heard that some of those investors are deciding not to go through with their purchases, giving up their down payments, to avoid being left holding units they cannot sell.

    "Contracts are falling through because people are walking away from the closing table," he said. "It's a rare occurrence, but the fact it is happening at all is throwing up red flags."

    Wenhold said some builders are likely to be unable to sell out their projects, and he speculated that some will end up in foreclosure.

    To help sales, condo developers are offering incentives, such as waiving condo fees for a time or helping with closing costs, Delta Associates found. Some builders are cutting prices as much as $30,000.

    "Concessions eat into the bottom line for developers, but have become necessary in some cases to help units move quicker," the study found.

    Much of the growth is coming in suburban Maryland, where several new projects are underway in Prince George's County. In the next three years, about 17,400 units will be built in suburban Maryland or converted from rentals into condominiums, by Delta's count. In Hyattsville, for example, Federal Capital Partners is converting a 210-unit mid-rise building into a condominium.

    The pace of new condominium development is slowing somewhat in Northern Virginia, although it makes up the biggest share of the region's condo market, with about 24,000 units being readied for sale within the next three years, according to Delta Associates. About 9,900 units are being built or marketed in the District.
    I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

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    • #3
      There's private housing in Shanghai?? I didn't know that. When I was there a little over a year ago, I saw row upon row of residential buildings but I assumed they were "people's housing" not privately owned condos.

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      • #4
        This is actually a good thing. It resulted in lots of modern housing units built but the speculators are taking a bit of a bath so that now those modern units are more affordable. In the long run this will be good for Shanghai.
        Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

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        • #5
          30% down to buy a house is amazing, in California 30% would be at least a couple hundred G's.
          Visit First Cultural Industries
          There are reasons why I believe mankind should live in cities and let nature reclaim all the villages with the exception of a few we keep on display as horrific reminders of rural life.-Starchild
          Meat eating and the dominance and force projected over animals that is acompanies it is a gateway or parallel to other prejudiced beliefs such as classism, misogyny, and even racism. -General Ludd

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          • #6
            "She really over-reacts whenever she catches me wearing her underwear."

            Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

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            • #7
              I think the things you and your gf argue has another thread..
              In da butt.
              "Do not worry if others do not understand you. Instead worry if you do not understand others." - Confucius
              THE UNDEFEATED SUPERCITIZEN w:4 t:2 l:1 (DON'T ASK!)
              "God is dead" - Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" - God.

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              • #8
                Interesting threadjack.
                I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Zkribbler
                  There's private housing in Shanghai?? I didn't know that. When I was there a little over a year ago, I saw row upon row of residential buildings but I assumed they were "people's housing" not privately owned condos.
                  As I understand it, there is mixture of old housing doled out to employees of state-owned industries long ago, and new housing that is private (in a manner of speaking -- the land is not owned by the individual, but is leased from the government).
                  I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

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                  • #10
                    The leases are however often of the 99-year variety.
                    Visit First Cultural Industries
                    There are reasons why I believe mankind should live in cities and let nature reclaim all the villages with the exception of a few we keep on display as horrific reminders of rural life.-Starchild
                    Meat eating and the dominance and force projected over animals that is acompanies it is a gateway or parallel to other prejudiced beliefs such as classism, misogyny, and even racism. -General Ludd

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Smiley
                      30% down to buy a house is amazing, in California 30% would be at least a couple hundred G's.
                      So's in Hong Kong. The max you can mortgage a flat is 70%. Though after the Asian Financial Crisis a government Mortgage Insurance Company can loan you another 20%, or maybe even 25%.
                      (\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
                      (='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
                      (")_(") "Starting the fire from within."

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                      • #12
                        I'm looking at buying a place in Hong Kong. The problem with the extra 20% loan is that it has a US$20,000 insurance fee.

                        Haven't decided whether to do it because the cost of housing here is so high. One place I'm looking at, a new flat, is selling for HK$3.5 million, or $450,000 for 600 sq feet.
                        Golfing since 67

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                        • #13
                          Is it true that you would have to pay a US$20,000 fee for a US$90,000 20% loan? Damn!

                          Regarding those prices, they seem similar to the prices in central New York, San Francisco, and London. Pretty unreal. About 2x the price of central Washington. About 6x of exurban midwest (and they'll throw in an acre or two of land to boot).
                          I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

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                          • #14
                            I don't know but that's what the HSBC mortgage calculator says. Of course, the 90,000 loan is for 30 years, but still.

                            That's why I'm thinking of waiting until I have enough for a 70 percent loan.

                            I've been meaning to go to the bank to get the details.
                            Golfing since 67

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by DanS
                              Is it true that you would have to pay a US$20,000 fee for a US$90,000 20% loan? Damn!
                              Other way around. He's borrowing 80% of the money, I think.
                              12-17-10 Mohamed Bouazizi NEVER FORGET
                              Stadtluft Macht Frei
                              Killing it is the new killing it
                              Ultima Ratio Regum

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