Why must intelligent design be stopped

[Kuciwalker]

How many times do I have to tell you retards I AGREE WITH YOU!!!

And therefore it has no place in schools, or in scientific literature. And therefore, IMO, it's false, since I'm an atheist.

[Patroklos]

[quote]And therefore it has no place in schools, or in scientific literature.[/quote

Wrong, it sure as hell belongs in history and theology.

And therefore, IMO, it's false, since I'm an atheist.

Atheism is a belief, not unlike any other. By this very standard you have given all the justification creationists need to not only put ID in books, but banish evolution all together.

Two threads you have spectacularly undermined yourself in.

[Kuciwalker]

Atheism is a belief, not unlike any other.

*insert resigned explanation about the differences between positive and negative atheism*

[BlackCat]

Originally posted by Patroklos


Atheism is a belief, not unlike any other. By this very standard you have given all the justification creationists need to not only put ID in books, but banish evolution all together.

Two threads you have spectacularly undermined yourself in.

No. Atheism isn't a belief and it certainly differs from any religion known. How can you compare faith in some kind of god and the knowledge that gods doesn't exist ?

[Kuciwalker]

Oh, and I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours.

[Patroklos]

can you compare faith in some kind of god and the knowledge that gods doesn't exist ?

Because you don't have said knowledge. But please, pretty please say there is, and better yet say you know because of science.

Since you have no proof God does not exist, you believe it on faith (I think based on science, but I will give you a chance to pull yourself out of the tar). Just like I have no proof God does exist, I believe it on faith.

[BlackCat]

Originally posted by Patroklos


Because you don't have said knowledge. But please, pretty please say there is, and better yet say you know because of science.

Since you have no proof God does not exist, you believe it on faith (I think based on science, but I will give you a chance to pull yourself out of the tar). Just like I have no proof God does exist, I believe it on faith.

Quite right - I don't have that knowledge, but I don't need science to prove the lack of a divinity - the randomness of life is enough.

[Patroklos]

Quite right - I don't have that knowledge, but I don't need science to prove the lack of a divinity - the randomness of life is enough.

Fine, but with that admittion that you don't know, and you can't use science to prove it, your athiesm operates like everything else you and others have faith in, including religion

[BlackCat]

Originally posted by Patroklos


Fine, but with that admittion that you don't know, and you can't use science to prove it, your athiesm operates like everything else you and others have faith in, including religion

I'm not quite sure what you are trying to say.

I don't belive in gods because they have never proved their existence and I can't belive in gods just on faith because that doesn't make sense to me.

[Odin]

Originally posted by Arrian

The cool part, though, is that in order to have ANY hope of being taken seriously, they had to adopt liberal/secular language and at least PRETEND to be scientific. Which, viewed in a broader sense, means that they've already lost.

No, that they are trying to sound scientific is a VERY BAD thing, because ignorant Joe Smoe with buy into it easier if it sounds scientific.

[Odin]

Originally posted by Deity Dude


Well its getting a little repetitive here, but as I stated earlier, throughout history that established scientific facts or theories were later proven wrong or partially wrong. Those who initially proposed the new theory were either an individual or in the minority. If you don't accept what I just said you know nothing about the history of science. If you do accept what I said your comment above is irrelevant. The only thing that is relevant si the new theory, or in this case, the objections to the current theory.

I have not seen any legitamite objections to Darwinian evolution. All the objections I've heard were from people who don't have a proper understanding of evolutionary biology, or is creationist propaganda that is obviously wrong to a evolutionary bilogists but easily accepted by ignorant lay people.

Just because theories in the past have been proven wrong means nothing. complaing just because a theory might, just might, be overthrown in the future is stupid; it reminds me of those post-modernist fools who think there is no absolute truth.

[GePap]

Originally posted by Patroklos


Because you don't have said knowledge. But please, pretty please say there is, and better yet say you know because of science.

Since you have no proof God does not exist, you believe it on faith (I think based on science, but I will give you a chance to pull yourself out of the tar). Just like I have no proof God does exist, I believe it on faith.

If I have no evidence of aliens, not believing in aliens is not an act of faith. Its an act of common sense.

If I have no evidence of aliens, and I believe in them, that is an act of faith.

People can be religiously atheistic-and those people can be annoying- but its hard to be "faithful" to a negation of something.

[Kuciwalker]

I presume that since Patroklos did not respond to my points he conceded them

[Patroklos]

Actually I am tearing my hair out because Civ IV is a worthless piece of crap, and Sid must really hate ATI.

You had a point?

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Patroklos
Since when did these people include even the majority of IDers, let alone most religious people.

I am not sure if you have been following the case in Kansas and the one in PA (now). The "expert witnesses" for pushing ID back into HS classrooms are very prominent IDers. You can check The Panda's Thumb for details.

Originally posted by Patroklos
If you want to crusade against some fundies be my guest,when you intentionally include millions of people who are keeping the various worlds properly seperated you come of as a fundie, and daft as hell.

There are millions of IDers?

Originally posted by Patroklos
ID and evolution are simply not at odds.

Intelligent Design is simply a thinly veiled version of Creationism. Take a look at Discovery Institute's "wedge strategy." If IDers are not at odds with evolution, why are they so hell-bent on getting ID taught as an alternative to evolution in HS science?