iTunes and classical music

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by nostromo
Furtwangler, the Nazi? Did you see Taking sides?

Yes, which would make me baffled you'd say he was a Nazi, as he certainly wasn't.

Karajan, on the other hand, joined the Nazi party twice.

[Nostromo]

Hence the , Although I saw it a long while ago, the movie's message was more ambiguous than you let on. Furtwangler probably wasn't a Nazi per se, even though he probably was a member of the Party, but as I recall it, he enjoyed the benefits of being Hitler's favorite conductor, and it flattered his vanity being considered Germany's number one conductor, instead of Karajan. But he had principles. Karajan, OTOH, was clearly an opportunist.

[Nostromo]

Originally posted by Datajack Franit
psst- he´s gay. he knows better what´s good for you

Ahhh, the gay mystique... You guys can be so full of yourselves sometimes... Would you say the same for Mr. Fun or Asher? And what do you do when they give contradictory advice? Asher says: Rob Thomas rules, dude! And Boris says: don't listen to Rob Thomas, listen to Mahler instead! What do I do? Who can I thrust?

[Imran Siddiqui]

In that case... Boris, without a doubt!

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by nostromo
Hence the , Although I saw it a long while ago, the movie's message was more ambiguous than you let on. Furtwangler probably wasn't a Nazi per se, even though he probably was a member of the Party, but as I recall it, he enjoyed the benefits of being Hitler's favorite conductor, and it flattered his vanity being considered Germany's number one conductor, instead of Karajan. But he had principles. Karajan, OTOH, was clearly an opportunist.

This is the problem with relying on plays to get history. It's not accurate. Furtwangler was never a member of the Nazi party whatsoever, and he was not in the least bit enthralled by Hitler. One of the things that got him fired from the BPO in the first place was his standing up to the Nazis and playing the music of Hindemith despite a ban on Jewish composers.

He was used by the Nazis for propaganda, and sadly he was naive and in some instances childishly petty (such as the Karajan rivalry), which enabled them to use him even more. He saw himself as a force of good in spite of Nazism, not its pawn. Thiis was his overestimation of the power of music to bring goodness to the world.

Another thing he did was write letters of recommendation for over 100 musicians, mostly Jewish, that enabled them to secure posts in foreign orchestras and thus escape Nazi Germany. He even wrote false letters for ones he didn't even know.

[Boris Godunov]

And I wouldn't know Rob Thomas if I heard him.

[Asher]

Originally posted by nostromo
Ahhh, the gay mystique... You guys can be so full of yourselves sometimes... Would you say the same for Mr. Fun or Asher? And what do you do when they give contradictory advice? Asher says: Rob Thomas rules, dude! And Boris says: don't listen to Rob Thomas, listen to Mahler instead! What do I do? Who can I thrust?

People from Quebec have terrible music taste by default. Celine Dion will never be forgiven.

As a sidenote, there are banners around campus:

"Spandex. Celine Dion. Wires.
None of them belong on campus."

It's an ad for the wireless internet, but it's true.

[MosesPresley]

Boris do you like modern classical? If so, can you recommend a good version of Illuminations of the Beyond by Messiaen.

I have found:
Berlin Philharmonic Orch/Sir Simon Rattle
Myung-Whun Chung, Bastille Opera Orchestra
Antoni Wit (Conductor), Katowice Polish Radio National Orchestra

Thanks

[Nostromo]

Originally posted by Asher

People from Quebec have terrible music taste by default. Celine Dion will never be forgiven.

As a sidenote, there are banners around campus:

"Spandex. Celine Dion. Wires.
None of them belong on campus."

It's an ad for the wireless internet, but it's true.

It was only a joke, based on some polytubbies' prejudices. Don't take it personally, I'm not saying you have terrible taste in music. I'm not that childish.

Btw, not everyone in Quebec likes Celine Dion. I certainly don't. There are probably more people outside Quebec who like Celine Dion.

[Boris Godunov]

I'm only familiar with the Rattle recording, which is generally considered one of the best there is. Not really my cup of tea, though. Some moments of amazing beauty, to be sure.

[Agathon]

There's nothing wrong with Karajan's first two Beethoven sets. Boris just doesn't like him. The Harnoncourt set is probably the best single box of any of them.

Ahhh, the gay mystique... You guys can be so full of yourselves sometimes...

He's full of himself all the time.

[Boris Godunov]

I don't have a problem with Karajan with the right composers. For instance, I think is Wagner and Bruckner are top-notch (but Furtwangler still beats him on those, too ). He also has a great way of dazzling with orchestral showpieces. But he gets into serious trouble in the classical era. His Mozart is particularly bloated (and Furtwangler had the same problem, both try to "Wagnerize" him).

[Boris Godunov]

And I think the best bang-for-your-buck Beethoven set is still the Szell/Cleveland Orchestra. You can get it for under $40, and the performances are rock solid all-round. Only the 9th disappoints me a little, but that's because I think the vocalists aren't that great (esp. the baritone, who lacks sufficient heft).

[Agathon]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
And I think the best bang-for-your-buck Beethoven set is still the Szell/Cleveland Orchestra. You can get it for under $40, and the performances are rock solid all-round. Only the 9th disappoints me a little, but that's because I think the vocalists aren't that great (esp. the baritone, who lacks sufficient heft).

Yes that is a good set, although the recording sometimes leaves something to be desired.

However, it is very old fashioned (like a lot of your recommendations - not that there's anything wrong with that). As is Karajan and all the others that you recommended. Harnoncourt's set can be obtained for the same price and is probably the best set recorded in the last 30 years. Harnoncourt has managed to get the good aspects of period performance down without making some of the obvious mistakes that other sets (like Hogwood's and Gardiner's) make.

If you are going to buy a set, Harnoncourt's is simply the best, both in terms of price and quality. It's rare that you can say that.

The best thing to do in any case is to buy a set and then fill out your collection with individual recordings of particular works.

Only an idiot would not have Kleiber's VPO recording of the 5th and 7th. Similarly, if you can handle the sound, Furtwangler's Bayreuth 9th is worth it. Same goes for Davis's 7th, there are many fine Eroicas.

As for Mozart.... I don't know why anyone still buys traditional performances. The period instrument movement has completely owned Mozart for the last 15 years. Traditional performances sound lame and overblown when compared to Pinnock's or Gardiner's work.

[Nostromo]

I almost bought Kleiber's VPO recording of the 5th and 7th, but didn't because it was a bit expensive IRC. Not to mention that I don't care much for the 5th: I've heard it too many times.

I would say the same of Mozart. Unfortunately, I can't help but feel that listening to Mozart nowadays is a bit like having a reproduction of Van Gogh in your living room: its somewhat kitschy. Two great artists, Mozart and Van Gogh, unfortunate victims of overexposure.