Someone Tell the President the War is Over

[Dis]

Originally posted by child of Thor


I thought it was his only point?......and it was a cluster f**k from the off.

he has other points. But they are all weak as well.

many child left behind act.

That's more significant in my city where our schools are failing miserably.

[Chemical Ollie]

Told you so, 3 years ago!

[Dis]

Originally posted by Az
Damn, your people are a bunch of flipfloppers.

I admit I flip-flopped on the war. I learned from the best- John Kerry (I voted for him too ). While I now feel the initial war was a mistake, I don't advocate leaving. That would be another mistake.

[Imran Siddiqui]

In addition, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that the party which would be more supportive of an earlier pull-out would be the Democrats, and that's where all the anti-war votes would have to go. The Republicans are more likely to bang their heads against the wall to vindicate Bush.

[techumseh]

Semantical quibbling over the definition of "groundswell" aside, there is a clear movement in public opinion against the war and for withdrawal. This is not reflected in the position of the Democratic leadership, which continues to support the occupation of Iraq. Totally complicit in Bush's lies and aggression in Iraq, they are now standing back and letting Bush take the heat. By adopting the line that the war has been "mismanaged" rather than being illegal, ill-advised and unjustified, they hope to defeat a number of Republicans at the next election, without having to disavow the war and commit to an early withdrawal.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by child of Thor


I thought it was his only point?

No, although it's his favourite point.

Bush really is a ****ing muppet. He has no feel whatsoever for any complex issue. His "plainspokenness" is just so much simpleness (and yes, I do mean that in the pejorative sense).

It leads to dumbass moves like invading Iraq. Was it really a surprise that the war itself (with its uncomplicated goals) was exquisitely planned while the peace (with all its complexity) was not? Or that Bush tries the same methods on domestic issues? He prefers large, radical movement, and expects the real world to react simply and according to his preconceptions.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Dis


I admit I flip-flopped on the war. I learned from the best- John Kerry (I voted for him too ). While I now feel the initial war was a mistake, I don't advocate leaving. That would be another mistake.

And you're right on both counts.

[Dis]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse


No, although it's his favourite point.

Bush really is a ****ing muppet. He has no feel whatsoever for any complex issue. His "plainspokenness" is just so much simpleness (and yes, I do mean that in the pejorative sense).

It leads to dumbass moves like invading Iraq. Was it really a surprise that the war itself (with its uncomplicated goals) was exquisitely planned while the peace (with all its complexity) was not? Or that Bush tries the same methods on domestic issues? He prefers large, radical movement, and expects the real world to react simply and according to his preconceptions.

I really don't think the Iraq war was planned by Bush. Cheney probably had more to do with it. It all boils down to ties with Haliburton. And all the money they would make by invading.

And I think Bush only invaded Iraq because they tried to kill his daddy.

[Imran Siddiqui]

and im sure a lot of them think we should fight the war seriously, and send enough troops to win, and not skimp on troops to advance a scheme of military transformation. and make sure those troops are adequately equipped. And drop a SecDef when hes become a liability, not an asset.

Send enough troops? From where exactly? The problem is that we're bogged down in Afghanistan and Iraq and woefully missing recruitment goals and unless we are planning a draft, troops are in very short supply.

The best way to oppose Bush is to not argue that we don't have enough troops. It is to argue that the entire thing is a cluster**** on massive proportions and we should try to set a timetable to get the Hell out of there.

[Dis]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

and im sure a lot of them think we should fight the war seriously, and send enough troops to win, and not skimp on troops to advance a scheme of military transformation. and make sure those troops are adequately equipped. And drop a SecDef when hes become a liability, not an asset.

Send enough troops? From where exactly? The problem is that we're bogged down in Afghanistan and Iraq and woefully missing recruitment goals and unless we are planning a draft, troops are in very short supply.

The best way to oppose Bush is to not argue that we don't have enough troops. It is to argue that the entire thing is a cluster**** on massive proportions and we should try to set a timetable to get the Hell out of there.

we could get rid of all our bases (except the hospital- we need that as the Iraq war has shown) in germany.

[Az]

Timetable is the ****ing worst thing possible in these cases.

[KrazyHorse]

Bull****.

It has to do with ideologues in high positions and a president who sees only bad guys and good guys. Saddam was a bad guy, an eternal threat to US security. The ideologues also seized on him as the tool to make their theories on the ME become reality.

Cheney's a bully and just wants to fight anybody who causes trouble for the US.

[Imran Siddiqui]

No, a timetable something absolutely necessary, unless we want to be stuck in a quagmire for the indefinate future.

[Az]

No, a timetable something absolutely necessary, unless we want to be stuck in a quagmire for the indefinate future.

Oh, the people of the US will love it! Too bad for the people of Iraq, I guess.

[Dis]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
No, a timetable something absolutely necessary, unless we want to be stuck in a quagmire for the indefinate future.

a timetable is a good thing. You just don't release the timetable. You want to give the illusion to the insurgents that you will be there forever if that's what it takes. I'm not sure if that would work, but what they are doing now sure as hell isn't working.