Karl Rove and Lewis "Scooter" Libby may both face perjury charges

[Guynemer]

Why jail of a member of the press sympathetic to the Administration, when they can just as easily jail someone they can link to the so-called Liberal Media?

[Koyaanisqatsi]

Novak is not a person who is supposed to have access to secret documents...that's the failure point, and the whole point of security levels etc.

[Wezil]

Originally posted by Koyaanisqatsi
Novak is not a person who is supposed to have access to secret documents...that's the failure point, and the whole point of security levels etc.

Hypothetical - So if Novak were to learn from a government source about impending troop movements and reported this information there would be no problem?

[Mordoch]

Originally posted by Wezil
Hypothetical - So if Novak were to learn from a government source about impending troop movements and reported this information there would be no problem?

While I'd have to look up the exact laws, frequently the answer is yes its legal. The exception might be if the government gets an injunction from a court against publishing the information in advance. Otherwise you'd probably need to demonstrate something like a foreign intelligence agency paid him to reveal the information in order to go after Novak. Ordinarily you can only go after the leaker, although right now the federal government can go after reporters that refuse to provide info on who and where their sources on classified info are.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Wezil


Hypothetical - So if Novak were to learn from a government source about impending troop movements and reported this information there would be no problem?

Apparently not. Geraldo suffered few problems for doing just that. He's even still employed by Fox.

[Guynemer]

Well, to be fair DD, it's not like he's employed by a reputable news organization. It is Fox, after all.

[Boris Godunov]

Novak wasn't a leaker, as he didn't have access to the classified information. He was a leakee. Rove, however, appears to have gotten the info from a top secret memo that was, for some reason, being carried around by members of the administration. On a related note, Ari Fleischer may end up in hot water as well, as he explicitly denied ever seeing the memo, but it's now been shown from several sources that he was carrying it around Air Force One.

Oh what a tangled web we weave...

[Ramo]

I was watching the Congressional hearing on C-Span, and Larry Johnson made an interesting point: if the leak caused no damage to our operations and didn't endanger anyone, the CIA damage assessment report would've almost certainly been leaked.

[SpencerH]

Originally posted by Ramo
I was watching the Congressional hearing on C-Span, and Larry Johnson made an interesting point: if the leak caused no damage to our operations and didn't endanger anyone, the CIA damage assessment report would've almost certainly been leaked.

It was a democratic hearing not a congressional hearing. I didnt bother to watch the whole thing, just a few minutes watching the 'experts' testify confirmed my previously held opinions of them i.e. I doubt their credibility and motives.

Thats not to say, however, that part of what they say isnt true. This matter is detrimental to intel and prolonging it only makes it worse. Whether anyone in the administration is guilty of a crime is irrelevant at this point, what they purportedly did was wrong. Even if they didnt know that Plame was CIA they shouldnt have discussed it at all. Merely doing so lends substance to the assertion (as does the continued Democrat-led publicity).

I'd like to see Bush fire anyone/everyone involved in this issue (they can quibble over the meaning of the word 'is' when they are no longer a part of the administration) and I'd like to see it now. The fact that Bush has not already fired them is disappointing.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by SpencerH
The fact that Bush has not already fired them is disappointing.

I'd have had to expect Bush to do so to be disappointed. The man is a hack and more loyal to his freinds than his country or his job. Under most situations, that is a very admirable position. It's not something I want in a politician. Their job comes first. If they don't like the responsibility that comes with it, they shouldn't seek the office.

[Ramo]

It was a Congressional hearing where only Democratic members participated. Some of the witnesses were Republicans (i.e. Larry Johnson).

As I said on the other thread, your objections are absurd. The publicity doesn't do any damage. Rove, Libby, et al. compromised Plame and her fake company's assets, period; what happens after the fact doesn't change anything. There's absolutely no reason to doubt the witnesses' - yes expert, ex-CIA in leadership roles and/or with personal knowledge of Plame's role in the Agency - credibility or motives.

[Ramo]

I don't understand how you can say that if Plame is recast as an anaylst desk jockey who isn't involved in operations, somehow related operations are salvaged. Any foreign WMD expert who has dealt with her or her fake company knows that they're CIA, and thus not trustable. And that's the end of it. Ex-CIA contradicting GOP talking points about her doesn't hurt operations in anyway.

[Dr Strangelove]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Nixon brought down by an investigation of an incident originally not thought to be directly related to him? Could we be seeing the beginning of something bigger? They've got 3 years to pull it off. I think it took 2 years to bring down Nixon.

[Ramo]

If Dear Leader was involved in the coverup, and if that can be proven, an impeachment trial isn't unimaginable (though, it probably requires the Democrats to retake Congress by a fair margin).

There does seem to be a bigger conspiracy than just Rove and Libby, though.

FWIW, there was a recent Zogby poll, before the Rove matter erupted, that said that 42% of Americans (and a quarter of Republicans) would support impeachment if it's proven that Shrub lied about going into Iraq.

http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.dbm?ID=1007

[SpencerH]

Originally posted by Ramo
It was a Congressional hearing where only Democratic members participated. Some of the witnesses were Republicans (i.e. Larry Johnson).

As I said on the other thread, your objections are absurd. The publicity doesn't do any damage. Rove, Libby, et al. compromised Plame and her fake company's assets, period; what happens after the fact doesn't change anything. There's absolutely no reason to doubt the witnesses' - yes expert, ex-CIA in leadership roles and/or with personal knowledge of Plame's role in the Agency - credibility or motives.

It was a democratic hearing not a congressional one http://democrats.senate.gov/~dpc/pre...005721656.html

Perhaps you didnt notice it was co-chaired by two democrats? Your inability to even get the insignificant facts correct speaks volumes with respect to your opinions on this matter.

The witnesses:
Larry Johnson, former CIA analyst;
Jim Marcinkowski, former CIA case officer;
David McMichael, former CIA case officer;
Mel Goodman, former senior CIA analyst.

None of these guys had "leadership roles and/or with personal knowledge of Plame's role in the Agency - credibility or motives". They were all small fish in the agency. As I tried to explain previously, even if they were only mailmen with security clearances, they should know better than to flap their gums about this issue (which is why I question their credibility and motives).

Dont you think that there are people who really know what Plame did for the agency? Where is their testimony? As a minimum, hows about getting testimony from someone who is actually active instead of these retirees and washouts? Dont you think the Dems would've got someone with a little more 'gravitas' to testify if they could?

Your ignorance about intel matters is deafening.