just. plain. STUPID.

[Pyrodrew]

Now, guys. You've all been utterly thrashed by me single handedly, and also made yourselves look like a bunch of culturally insensitive racists. I suggest this end now.

"Y'all" and "ain't" are proper contractions. Stop oppressing my culture!

Until dees' are taughtin public schools I reckon' dis' discrimi nation will continue.

Dis' will have to do for naw...Diction Guide to the South

BUB (noun)
an incandescent lamp
Usage: "The lite bub done burned out agin'."

JEW (contraction)
Short form of "did" and "you"
Usage: "Jew hear that my brother got a job with that bobbed war fence cump'ny ?"

RAT NOW (adverb)
immediately
Usage: "I sed go git 'em boy, rat now."

YURP (proper noun)
A continent
Usage: "We'ems a-savin' fur a trip to Yurp."

[chequita guevara]

I don't know why people so hate Black English Vernacular, except maybe for the Black part.

I have spoken to people whose BEV was so thick I couldn't understand what the hell they were saying, even to the point of him asking me if I understood English (to which I sais Yes, now would you speak some).

So many people seem like it's a personal insult that they don't do everything just like you. Yet we claim to value individuality.

[Last Conformist]

@Imran & Co: Since they're not removing standard English, where's the harm? Do you think that reading books in AAVE will somehow magically prevent them from speaking standard when the occasion demands it?

Originally posted by JimmyCracksCorn
Its about building awareness and creating a proud and unique cultural identity.

Divide and rule

[BlackCat]

That's the funny part of dialects

I have often been in sweden and don't have many problems understanding them, but they seems not to be able to understand danish - guess that they have been on their own hand just a little too long. It's quite awkward that you have to speak english to a swede if you want them to understand what you say .

[DerSchwarzfalke]

Who was the idiot calling Ebonics a "foreign language." It is definitely a separate and recognized dialect of American Standard English, but that does not make it a "foreign language." It would be like teaching a separate language course called "British English" in America.

I can understand incorporating an understanding of Vernacular African-American into regular English classes, but a separate language? Horse****.

[Kuciwalker]

Who was the idiot calling Ebonics a "foreign language." It is definitely a separate and recognized dialect of American Standard English, but that does not make it a "foreign language." It would be like teaching a separate language course called "British English" in America.

British English is comprehensible.

[DarkCloud]

Come on guys, I know we're sheltered here on Poly, but lets be serious for a minute. Are you really trying to tell me that you've never left your neighborhood, never been anywhere where people speak English differently than you? Its a great big world out there, guys. There's room enough for everyone.

If they could be understood then there would be no need for 'ebonics-texts'

[DanS]

I'm all for cultural genocide in our situation.

That said, I think the "standardization" argument (official languages, etc.) is pretty weak. Better to go with the "we know what's good for them" tack.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Last Conformist
@Imran & Co: Since they're not removing standard English, where's the harm? Do you think that reading books in AAVE will somehow magically prevent them from speaking standard when the occasion demands it?

The harm is in teaching dialect spellings as they are ok to be used in the working world. Even in the South, you'd be laughed out of the office if you wrote "y'all" on an official memo or something. It isn't ok in the business environment and therefore shouldn't be taught. No dialects are taught in the public schools (and the only place you'd ever see it is in a Literature course), why should Ebonics?

[Saras]

Because there was slavery 150 years ago.

[Kaak]

Jimmy: The situation is this. Americans are some of the worst educated people in the modern world. We are deficitent in math, languages, history, geography, etc etc etc. Spending valuable class time, in a precollegiate situation, on something like ebonics is a complete and total waste of resources and time. Cultural education should come second to the foundations of knowledge which are absolutely essential for being a thriving, productive member of society. This proposal is assinine.

[Sikander]

I'd have no problem with people studying "ebonics" or other American dialects as part of an introduction to linguistics. I would have enjoyed something like that myself and I think many people would benefit from it.

I do have a problem with public schools using class time and public resources to cater to any particular minority culture's perceived need to have their self-esteem raised. Not only is such a program likely to fail in this objective, but experience of several decades of such programs at the college level seems to indicate that in fact tensions between cultures are likely to be exacerbated and that the level of scholarship produced by such programs will likely be exceedingly poor.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by JimmyCracksCorn
Standard English and Ebonics versus French and German are apples and oranges.

You don't understand. I do speak German. It's just that my German is heavily accented and that it is hesitant.

I can communicate without any significant hindrance with my German-speaking hierarchy, but the language demands of the customers are quite a bit higher. As a result, I'm barred from a great many jobs that involve a "perfect" German (That's how the job-suppliers put it, when they clearly require a native German).

I think that somebody who exclusively speaks Ebonics will have an English skill about as good as my own skill in German. I.e. an obstacle that considerably reduces opportunities. If you want to be so ivory tower that you prefer thinking of the ebonics culture over the actual future of these kids, go ahead. But don't call us names for putting these kid's future over somecultural feelgood.

[chequita guevara]

Why is there an assumption by so many people that this means that standard American Enlish will no longer be taught?

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Why is there an assumption by so many people that this means that standard American Enlish will no longer be taught?

I'm still not clear on why Ebonics should be taught and not Creationism?