China threatens to nuke hundreds of cities

[Drake Tungsten]

And I doubt the Afghans would be able to defend that strip against the Chinese.

Who cares? There's nothing in the Wakhan Corridor. The whole point is that the Chinese have to go all the way across the Hindu Kush to get close to any targets of importance, like Kabul. This isn't a small scale land-grab like the war with India in '62.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by GePap

Except that nuking land targets, specially ones near civlian areas were the possiblity of massive civlian damage is significant plays an etirely different PR story than hitting a purely military target were the collateral damage is minimal.

People are going to hold the country that threw the first nuke responsible for the larger exchange. Besides which we could use tactical nukes / enhanced radiation weapons to limit collateral damage.

Originally posted by GePap

The idea of a succesul blockade of China that would bring her down is absurd. China can feed itself, and her Asian neighbors, who have now a huge stake with their largest trade partner would not let their economies sink for Taiwan. China would still be able to import energy and goods from the outside by land. Certainly the shortage of various raw materials would hurt grealty as would the cut off of foreign investment, but the notion that the US could pull of a blockade that woul;d bring China to stavation is pure fantasy.

Thinking that we couldn't do so is fantasy. Sea power and air power are our specialties. We won't bother blasting track, we'll destroy bridges and engines. We'll destroy refineries, collapse tunnels, and blast pipelines where they cross rivers. We'll sink river craft. We'll blast hydroelectric dams, We'll isolate China from the outside and then we'll go to work on their internal communications. Starvation is rarely the result of lack of food, it is the inability to distribute it. But I doubt that it would come to that, as the resource crunch and the systematic destruction of infrastructure will likely take the wind out of their sails.

We don't have to deny western China oil / resources, it does them little good there. The vast majority of their population is within easy range of our aircraft, and they will be cut off without a doubt.

Originally posted by GePap
No I didn't. I said China will be willing to go farther than we are. For all the bluster from our leaders, lets not kid ourselves, Taiwan is not of particular interest to the American people, while it has huge significance for the Chinese. The Chinese are certainly willing to lose more, pay more, than Americans are for it, and unlike the US, Chinese governments don;t have to worry about an electorate disinchanted.

Am I the only person here who lived during the Cold War? We stood toe to toe with a much more powerful state in relative military terms for 50 years and covered states much less important to us under our nuclear umbrella. Hell, we even fought wars for states that mattered much less to us at the time.

[Patroklos]

We don't have to negotiate for that. We can just default on those notes.

That would cause a lot of economic problems, now if China voluntarily forgives the debt (hey, they sign the treaty too) then no problems at all, except for China.

The US doesn't have many planes that could easily and on a regular basis hit targets in Central Asia. One mission, fine, but after that the air defenses around it would be radically increased and trying to send any more long range bombers in would be less and less effective.

Maybe for WWII era airforces, your ignorance shows glaringly. We have bombers that can fly around the world GePap, let alone just from Japan to China. And we have a good many of them, a lot completely invulnerable to Chinese air defense. Which of course as stated would cease to exist in a weak or so, or at the very least will be more than consumed with defending itself, let alone strategic targets.

Then there are cruise missiles.

The cost of keeping the pipe repaired would be minimal. You can;t possibly think it otherwise. Its a pipe, for heaven's sake.

Perhaps you should look into how long it took to build the thing in the first place. Of course that was when the rest of their country wasn’t going up in smoke.
It all comes down to one factor GePap. We are capable of unleashing a whirlwind of destruction of China itself, and besides a limited nuclear first strike that would precipitate China disappearing entirely, they have nothing they can do to America directly.

Economically yes, we would be hurting, but to no greater extent than themselves and indeed the rest of the world. And since in any realistic scenario China starts hostilities, the wraith is on China’s head.

The power of airforces against mountains is far less than against those in open plain

A patently false comment. Are you telling me that if I isolate a convoy of troops to already known avenues of advance (passes of Afghanistan) inside an area already 100miles narrow, that is somehow harder than attacking over 1000s of miles anywhere within it. Besides the fact that it is doubtful anyone’s heavy equipment could make the trip, they would be the most restricted to predictable and very small target zones. Go ahead and send a few hundred thousand irregulars. Those that survive the cold to get incinerated from the air, or survive that too will simply starve to death when they reach the desert beyond with no hope of resupply from China itself. Doesn’t matter anyway, most of the Chinese army that is worth a damn would have drowned in the straights of Taiwan anyways. Remember Taiwan, the actual objective of the war.

As long as they keep getting refuled from the air at regular intervals. And again, B-2 are expensive and rare.

Luckily for us those regular intervals would be a few hundred miles West of Guam and then Afghanistan. Notice, not within China or anywhere near there pathetic power projection abilities.

nope, not with enough manpower ready to do it. Two nights at most. And if you think we would have 15 stealth bombers hitting either a pipeline or a railroad on the same night and on a regular basis, I think you are in dreamland.

You mean the manpower that is sitting on the other side of the bridge that no longer exists. But as pointed out already, we don’t have to blow up very much of the pipeline, just the parts over rivers and mountains. And I doubt we would use stealths for the pipeline, That would probably fall to cruise missiles. The stealths will be blowing up things like refineries and pumping stations and collection points that make the pipelines irrelevant anyways.

[DeathByTheSword]

are we dead yet?

[Dis]

Originally posted by Sikander


People are going to hold the country that threw the first nuke responsible for the larger exchange. Besides which we could use tactical nukes / enhanced radiation weapons to limit collateral damage.



Thinking that we couldn't do so is fantasy. Sea power and air power are our specialties. We won't bother blasting track, we'll destroy bridges and engines. We'll destroy refineries, collapse tunnels, and blast pipelines where they cross rivers. We'll sink river craft. We'll blast hydroelectric dams, We'll isolate China from the outside and then we'll go to work on their internal communications. Starvation is rarely the result of lack of food, it is the inability to distribute it. But I doubt that it would come to that, as the resource crunch and the systematic destruction of infrastructure will likely take the wind out of their sails.

We don't have to deny western China oil / resources, it does them little good there. The vast majority of their population is within easy range of our aircraft, and they will be cut off without a doubt.




Am I the only person here who lived during the Cold War? We stood toe to toe with a much more powerful state in relative military terms for 50 years and covered states much less important to us under our nuclear umbrella. Hell, we even fought wars for states that mattered much less to us at the time.

I don't know, China really gave us a beating in the Korean war. I can't see us doing anything to the chinese.

[FrostyBoy]

Nostradamus foresaw a great king rising from Mongolia and raining hell on all of Earth.

(Of course, it can't be Khan, because that was before Nostradamus time. )

[FrostyBoy]

The year 1999, seventh month,
From the sky will come a great King of Terror.
To bring back to life the great King of the Mongols,
Before and after Mars to reign by good luck.

Found it, now it says 1999, we have already passed 1999. But for all we know, the person came into power at 1999? Something happend at 1999 that will cause war in the near future? Maybe the person was born in 1999.

[Dis]

aha!!

I did find a threat the United States made to use nuclear weapons!!! Against China even.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Civil_War

It's near the bottom of the page.

The First Taiwan Straits crisis ended in March 1955 when the PLA ceased its bombardment, amid U.S. threats of escalation and use of nuclear weapons.

I proved myself wrong. I do that far too often.

[Dis]

Originally posted by Sn00py
The year 1999, seventh month,
From the sky will come a great King of Terror.
To bring back to life the great King of the Mongols,
Before and after Mars to reign by good luck.

Found it, now it says 1999, we have already passed 1999. But for all we know, the person came into power at 1999? Something happend at 1999 that will cause war in the near future? Maybe the person was born in 1999.

I think the guy from Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri (The Hive) was born that year.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Dis

I don't know, China really gave us a beating in the Korean war. I can't see us doing anything to the chinese.

Don't be dim! Firstly this is going to be a classic logistical battle in the air and on / under the sea. All of our bombs are now guided and can be dropped out of range of all but the most complex / expensive air defenses. Glibe bombs and cruise missles will increase this range when necessary. Nothing is going to get into Chinese ports. Internal communications will be degraded over time as bridges are destroyed and fuel becomes scarce. We won't be landing ground forces on the mainland.

[Dis]

and Chinese technology hasn't increased since 1951?

[Commy]

Originally posted by GePap


The US doesn't have many planes that could easily and on a regular basis hit targets in Central Asia. One mission, fine, but after that the air defenses around it would be radically increased and trying to send any more long range bombers in would be less and less effective.

Ever heard of the stealth bomber? Ever heard of the aircraft carrier? Ever heard of the Triton missiles and nuclear submarines?

Trust me, when B2's start raining thousands of pounds of accurate bombs on an oil pipeline, the Chinese will be repairing the pipeline 20 feet below where it used to be...

[DaShi]

I thought we used our two accurate bombs in Iraq.

[lord of the mark]

are people still J**king off about a straights war??

IF Taiwan behaves, no UDI or anything, a Chinese attack on Taiwan will look awfully aggressive, and will ruin their developing relations with southeast asia, and send India running to the arms of Uncle Sam. Why would they do it unless they had a major internal legitimacy crisis on their hands? And if they did, wouldnt that play into US options as well?

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by GePap

The idea of a succesul blockade of China that would bring her down is absurd. China can feed itself, and her Asian neighbors, who have now a huge stake with their largest trade partner would not let their economies sink for Taiwan.

yeah, the viet namese get this nice warm feeling whenever they think about China expanding by force.