What would it take to overthrow the U.S. goverment

[joncha]

Originally posted by Az
Some used chewing gum, a rope and a bar of soap in the hands of MacGyver.

MacGyver

[Az]

MacGyver

Mullets

[KrazyHorse]

What would it take to overthrow the U.S. goverment

Burt Lancaster and a nuclear disarmament treaty.

[chequita guevara]

Okay, this is how it will happen, if it happens.

#1, a party which is overtly revolutionary has to win the confidence off a significant portion of the population. This can only occur if it can prove itself useful to people, i.e., by helping them win in the various struggles we find ourselves: anti-war movements, anti-police brutality, strike support, jobless campaigns, union organizing, etc., etc.

In order for this to occur, there has to be a transformation of the various revolutionary sects themselves, a surrender of dogma and sectarianism. We also need to figure out how to win in the 21st century society, as the capitalists have ever more powerful weapons at their disposal: PR, communications, organization, training, etc. In other words, we need to figure out how to become relavent.

This is the real hurdle. Too many sects are fixated on doing what hasn't worked for the last 140 years, i.e., repeating the same thing over and over again until everyone finally wakes up one day to discover these guys were right all along. The second problem is these sects have a habit of attaching themselves to anything that occurs, but not with the goal of helping them win, but rather of seeing who they can recruit from the struggle. They have become just another set of parasites.

Assuming that this major hurdle can be cleared, and I make no assumptions that can happen, though the CPA is a infinitely small step in that direction (and I mean that seriously), the next step is to begin contesting for power in elections, proving ourselves capable of good governence, even within a capitalist system. For example, in Milwaukee, they still fondly remember the good clean government run by Socialist mayor Frank Zeidler. Vermont is going to soon have a socialist Senator in the U.S. Congress. We need to be able to do more of this. It's not enough to win struggles in the streets, we have to be able to govern as well.

Finally, a crisis of legitimacy needs to occur. This can happen because the United States is defeated in a war. It could occur because of a major economic downturn. It could occur because of a massive general strike. It could be the result of environmental collapse. Regardless of what causes it, the result will be a situation with which the government is unable to cope, and loses its legitimacy in the eyes of the people of the United States. At this moment, a revolutionary party can step forward and seize the reigns of history, if it has made itself relavent and legitimate in the eys of a large enough segment of the population, including enough of a segment of the military to ensure victory in case of civil war.

Whether or not there will be violence is up to the capitalists. In other words, there will be violence.

[Lancer]

che, you're dreaming. First you need an unpopular government, you don't have that. Hated by a fringe maybe, but that's it. Then, you need an unpopular government that has suspended the election process, otherwise they would just be voted out and people would wait until the next election rather than boosting their butts outa their easy chairs.

So, just hang out, get a job, watch the ball game and BBQ on Saturday, and wait for a president to cancel elections like the rest of us.

[Sprayber]

The goverment has a chance to be overthrown every 4 years. I know it's not as romantic as che's dreams but it sure beats constant civil war as little people with big heads think they are the answer to everyone's problems.



(for GePap)

[Patroklos]

-war movements, anti-police brutality, strike support, jobless campaigns, union organizing, etc., etc.

These people need first of all to be seen my 95% of the population as something other than crack pot loosers. And these people need to trancend from being overeducated students trying to feel important/get laid to people who actually experaince said problems and have a real greivance.

Whether or not there will be violence is up to the capitalists. In other words, there will be violence.

This is great. Dear capitalist, we are going to take away all your property, all your political power and franchise, take away your job, put a few of your family members and probobly yourself in a gulag, and madate you you at least say you like it. And if you say no and we come to take it from you by force, if you fight back it is you who is the cause of violence.

communits

[DeathByTheSword]

Originally posted by Sandman
Revealing both Janet Jackson's breasts live on air.

[Commy]

Let's put it this way...it's not that people CAN'T take down the government, it's that people WON'T take down the government...

The fact is, the American people aren't very dependant on the government...1 out 4 Americans own a gun...and not just a handgun, many own mulitple weapons...shotguns, assualt weapons, 9 mm pistols, automatic weapons...not to mention that there are a good number of tanks and military aircraft owned by civilians...not just for show, either, but tanks fully armed with shells and 50 caliber bullets...

Add on the fact that there are 50 states all with their own governments, private armies, whatever...think about it, do you honestly think that a suburban cop is going to enforce the will of an American dictator? No, they won't, and either will most national guard units...the higher ups might, but people will stick to their own agendas, and pretty soon soldiers and cops and national guards will just say "screw this"...Americans join the military for many reasons, but they only join it because their military supports one thing: freedom. Its not even capitalism that people want and fight for, its freedom, pure freedom...

Go ahead, overthrow the government...as long as you don't restrict freedom and don't go into foreign wars, people could honestly care less who is the "leader" of their country as long as nothing drastically affects them...go ahead, raise taxes 1%, no one will care...they'll wine, complain, but they could care less, because it doesn't really hurt them at all...

[Dis]

I don't know anyone who owns a tank or military aircraft (with weapons)

europeans sure have funny views of the U.S.

[Combat Ingrid]

Some years ago, the Swedish news interviewed some American dude who was so happy he had finally managed to get a Swedish S-Tank to his private collection

[Dis]

I'm sure they put cement in the barrell. I've seen antiaircraft guns that weren't in military use. But they are rendered inoperable.

[Lancer]

The more advanced weapons and surveilance tech becomes, the less likely it is that an armed citizenry could sucessfully overthrow a government. The only hope is that the soldiers would join the revolt before firing on the people. Kent State...

[Solver]

What it takes to overthrow a government is the military joining the revolters. Then it's over. In Georgia revolution, the turning point was when the army special forces and a few hours later the regular army joined the revolters. In Ukraine, the army refused to follow Yanukovich's orders, and so on. In the US too, if the army sided with the revolutioners, the government would be toppled. But, that's not going to happen because the US citizens and army have no reason to be that terribly unhappy with their domestic situation.

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by MikeH
Finding out the president has f*cked an intern?

Only if the intern is a boy. A teenege boy.