Help -Jrabbit buy his first PC laptop!

[Asher]

Ah, but your analogy doesn't work. MSO is an office suite, but so is OOo.

It is more like MSIE vs Firefox. Both are Web browsers, the former is a Microsoft product, the latter is FOSS (free and open source software).

Firefox is a quality product.

OpenOffice is an archaic, bloaty POS.

[-Jrabbit]

I'm so pleased I could provide a platform for this debate.

Re the Dark Side thing, I've used Macs at home and PCs at work for many years now. I currently own an iMac and a G3 Cube. They work fine, I like them a lot. But in this case, I'm trying to start a successful business, and a business-friendly laptop is part of the price of admission. Very different from making a statement of personal preference.

[Agathon]

Re the Dark Side thing, I've used Macs at home and PCs at work for many years now. I currently own an iMac and a G3 Cube. They work fine, I like them a lot. But in this case, I'm trying to start a successful business, and a business-friendly laptop is part of the price of admission. Very different from making a statement of personal preference.

And you call yourself a mac user. Our enemies are evil... EVIL... E-V-I-L!!!! You do realize that Darth Vader and the Empire are the bad guys?

You should really get a new mac with Tiger: easily the best OS I have ever used. Even those silly "widgets" turn out to be incredibly useful.

[Whaleboy]

OOo 1.1 has never crashed in our office, and we have quite a few people using it. So I'd say it doesn't have a stability problem.

Of course, this is refering to the Linux version. The Windows version may be flakier, I don't know, since we only have a couple of boxes with that around here.

I used the Linux version for 1.9, haven't used the Windows version since 1.1.3. I'd say you've got lucky with your hardware, MSO is far more fault-tolerant.

So, what's this claim of difference in speed?

RAM isn't the great equaliser, when you're loading poorly-written (in an inefficient language) bloat into RAM, it will take longer to load and be less responsive once it has, which is the case with OOo.

What's the size difference? 10%? 50%? 100%? When the PDF files are only 100-200K typically, a 10% difference is only 20K max. A drop in the bucket. I am not going to tweak the settings to optimise on size.

Or quality? Or images? Or security? Like I said before, the only way to squeeze more power out of PDF is to use Acrobat+MSO, if you're only using it for a basic document, *.doc is the better bet. The difference in size depends on settings and also the size of the document. While it won't be significant for a 5 page doc, for something of 50+ pages, Acrobat is the only option.

No. If you can distribute files in another format, you do. Not only .doc format is a vector for viruses, but they can be modified. So unless that is what you want, and even in that case, the preferred format is RTF.

Actually the last two places I worked, it was Word's XML format . All versions of MSO 2003 can run it, MSO Pro can create it. I'd like all to be able to create it but you can't win 'em all.

Fit a tool to the task at hand, not buy the most expensive solution there is. Why do somebody wants to pay for PhotoShop when all that power is not required? Get something cheaper! I guess that is the difference between somebody who's in the business sector and somebody who doesn't care about the cost.

You're not going to last very long in the business sector if you are arrogant enough to think you know better, and idiotic enough to do something other than what is asked of you. If someone (who is actually going to be doing the job), gives you a specific request for a tool, it's blatently common sense to give him what he asks. If he asks for MSO, give him MSO. If he asks for an Office Suite, give him options, and when he says he wants compatibility give him the option that best fits that, in this case MSO.

You'll be out on your arse faster than you can type OOo if you don't give your customers or those you work with what they ask for. You do not know how to do someone's job better than they do, when they are the ones who are making a living from doing it.

It is more like MSIE vs Firefox. Both are Web browsers, the former is a Microsoft product, the latter is FOSS (free and open source software).

You're not choosing a philosophy, you're choosing a tool. It's a little immature to be automatically associating Microsoft products with "big evil", which is an example of the virginal evangelism that scares people from using OSS. If someone asks me for IE, I give them IE. If someone asks for a web browser, I present them with honest optinos (since they'll be pissed off if something I've espoused doesn't live up to what I've said), and leave them to choose. FF is naturally the better product so they'll choose that.

[Jules]

Been browsing the IBM site. It looks like I can save quite a bit of money by going with a Pentium 4 instead of the Centrino tech. Any reason why I should still consider the more expensive option? I see it's much lighter.

Here's an example of what I'm looking at:

ThinkPad T42p (IBM Think Express Program)
2378RVU
1.80 GHz Intel® Pentium® M, Microsoft® Windows® XP Professional, 512 MB, 80 GB, 5.9 lbs, 15.0" UXGA IPS (1600x1200), IBM Embedded Security Subsystem and Integrated Fingerprint Reader, Intel PRO/Wireless Network Connection 802.11b/g, Gigabit Ethernet, 128MB ATI Mobility FIREGL T2, Multi-burner DVD Recordable, Ultrabay Slim
Availability**: Within 4 weeks
$2,484.00 web price*

ThinkPad G41(IBM Think Express Program)
288679U
3.33 GHz Intel® Pentium® 4, Microsoft® Windows® XP Professional, 512 MB, 80 GB, 8.36 lbs, 15.0" SXGA+ (1400x1050), No security subsystem, IBM 802.11b/g, Gigabit Ethernet, 128MB NVIDIA GeForce FX Go5200, Multi-burner DVD Recordable, Fixed Bay
Availability**: Within 4 weeks
$1,549.00 web price*

[Asher]

Pentium 4s are hot, power-hungry, and require relatively heavy/large laptops.

You really don't need the T42p...that's the mobile workstation with a very high-end graphics card and whatnot. It's pricey.

The T-series uses Pentium Ms/Centrinos, the T42p is one of the most expensive models of it. Consider a much cheaper one with a Pentium M/Centrino...you really don't need a 128MB FireGL T2 video card for your kind of work.

[Jules]

Uhm...work?

[Asher]

ThinkPads are not good gaming machines -- they don't come with gaming video cards/chips.

[Jules]

Ahh...ok.
What should I be looking at then if I want a notebook that's pretty decent for gaming?

[-Jrabbit]

Almost anything else. If it's not classified as a "business" machine, it will likely have acceptable graphics/sound/speed for most gaming, from what I've seen. (Actually, a lot of the business-class hardware is tricked out pretty nicely, to handle graphics programs and read multimedia sites.)

I'm not very knowledgeable, but I've been shopping...

[Whaleboy]

Depends on what you call "gaming". Whereas the original UT and, say, Chessmaster, could be perfectly happy with integrated graphics w/ 32Mb RAM, it's a different story for Doom III et al.

[Jules]

Let's suppose I'd want it to be able to comfortably handle some of the newer real-time battle engines such as Rome: Total War or Imperial Glory.

[Jules]

Ooh! How about this one--the Toshiba Qosmio?

http://www.toshibadirect.com/td/b2c/cfam.to?seg=HHO&coid=-28283&sel=0&rcid=-26367&ccid=1291021

[Asher]

http://www.toshibadirect.com/td/b2c/cmod.to?seg=HHO&coid=-28841&sel=0&rcid=-26367&ccid=1291021

That one seems ideal.

[-Jrabbit]

decided to go with a budget machine -- HP nx6110, 15 inch screen, Centrino @ 1.5 GB, 512 MB, 40 gig drive, combo dc/dvd.

Thx for your help, everyone.