Whose # 2

[alva]

Originally posted by Dauphin


There are many who say that Britain *is* an aircraft carrier.

Why isn't Europe as a whole not mentioned in the poll?

[Winston]

Originally posted by alva

Why isn't Europe as a whole not mentioned in the poll?

Now, it's not like it isn't missing, is it?

[Dinner]

China is much like the US in the 1890's. Inward looking and unsure of itself but possessing formidable financial and manufacturing power.

There big problem is they don't have the force projection capability to play with the big boys yet but if it keeps growing then they will have the money nd manufacturing ability to do it. The only real question is how quickly this is achieved and how much technical expertise they can convince the west or Russia to transfer to them.

[Dis]

Originally posted by Oerdin
China is much like the US in the 1890's. Inward looking and unsure of itself but possessing formidable financial and manufacturing power.

There big problem is they don't have the force projection capability to play with the big boys yet but if it keeps growing then they will have the money nd manufacturing ability to do it. The only real question is how quickly this is achieved and how much technical expertise they can convince the west or Russia to transfer to them.

which occurs to me. You don't become #1 by using other people's technlogy. You invent it yourself. If China wants to become a playa, they are going to have to do it themselves.

Sure USSR stole some tech from the U.S., but alot of their technology they came up with themselves.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by alva
Why isn't Europe as a whole not mentioned in the poll?

The Iraq crisis has showen how well Europe is at acting in concert.

[alva]

It's all a clever ploy ... so good, we believe it ourselves.

[GePap]

Personally, France and the UK are very close- their economies are about the same size, their military spending is similar, and the French do have military projection like the UK does (needed since they have used their military to intervene in a variety of places much more than the UK has) Yes, the UK has a couple of small carriers, and the French have one single slightly bigger carrier, thought the program to modernize their carrier force is stalled due to the budget- but they are planning to have a carrier that is more than a base for a dozen harriers. The fact the French decided not to place their forces in Iraq does not mean they can't.

I think diplomatically they have the same heft around the world- its not like the commonwealth gives the UK a huge advantage.

So I would point to an overall Franco-UK tie.

Germany, Japan, and China all have bigger economies, but lack in the force projection and diplomacy spheres.

[Japher]

I agree with GePap until he ends them in a tie. France losses because everyone thinks they are a bunch winney be'atches. Not to mention the fact that they only want to work 2 hours a day, have bad buisness structures, and persecute jews.

France has no clout and no cultural influence on any self respecting country...

Thus, UK is second.

[Dinner]

France does spend considerably more on defense ($46.5B vs $31.7B) but I believe much of the French budget gets eatten up by "draftees" who in practice end up painting government buildings and picking up roads side trash instead of planes, ships, and tanks like the British spend their money on.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/spending.htm

[St Leo]

Originally posted by Kontiki
Why do so many people overestimate the strength of China and underestimate that of the UK?

China has good PR and Britain has terrible PR.

[St Leo]

Originally posted by Japher
I agree with GePap until he ends them in a tie. France losses because everyone thinks they are a bunch winney be'atches.

s/everyone/Anglo-Americans/;

Not to mention the fact that they only want to work 2 hours a day,

w00t. Jetsons' style. The future is there now.

and persecute jews.

The hell?

France has no clout and no cultural influence on any self respecting country...

Are Russia and Turkey self-respecting countries?

[Dis]

although...

shouldn't the number of nukes be the sole determination in this thread?

And we all know who has the #2 of nukes.

Because if we are talking about power, nukes are power. Though they don't do much economically.

[St Leo]

Originally posted by Pax
As far as comedy goes. Most of us have no idea what how funny or not the chinese are. The most we ever really get to see is Jackie Chan.

Stephen Chow is hilarious. Check out his stuff.

[Krill]

Look up comparative GDP's. Start adding up western European countries. You'll notice you can stop after the big four.

what good is money if you can't produce the weaponry required to wage war? If you go on GDP alone, fine, UK wins. But remember that we were brought to our knees by German subs in WW2. As soon as that happens...

Better question would be to compare the industrial output (ie steel, iron, electricity, amount of food produced within their borders, and the amount imported etc...) of the western European countries, to that of China, and see who wins...

[Gary]

Nukes are possibly less important than you might think. To be any use you need to find a scenario you are willing to use them. Or others need to think there is one.