Populism and Nazism

[Whaleboy]

Nooo of course not, no more than being an moral emotivist makes me argue from emotions than logic . Taking a psychological angle means looking at human psychology and seeing how that effects politics, i.e., studies in obedience, group behaviour, discrimination, individual responsibility etc.

[Spiffor]

Well, psychological studies are interesting, but it's generally a leap of faith when psychological findings are generalized to the bulk of society.

"Collective psychology" (for this is what apparently interests you) is not something unfathomable, and it's not like there is a strict barrier between psychology and sociology or poli-sci. But it takes quite some work to see how the components of individual affects (psychology) affect the whole.

If you want to study the inner workings of people wrt obedience and their philosophical consequences, you've already set up for something very ambitious But if you want to further such a study by looking for the actual political consequences of these individual behaviours, you're setting up yourself for the work of your lifetime

[Whaleboy]

I guess that's where one draws the line between psychology, sociology and politics, in that order. In terms of political consequence, it's pretty straightforward... to propose doing something useful with it on the other hand... that's the difficult part.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Whaleboy
Nooo of course not, no more than being an moral emotivist makes me argue from emotions than logic . Taking a psychological angle means looking at human psychology and seeing how that effects politics, i.e., studies in obedience, group behaviour, discrimination, individual responsibility etc.

I don't think it plays much of a part. It's insignificant.

[Whaleboy]

So the psychology of the governed doesn't play much of a part in the politics of government?

[Kidlicious]

No. It's all determined by economics.

[BeBMan]

No. Marx was wrong.

[Whaleboy]

No. It's all determined by economics.

Ditto BeBro, and any economic element relies on being in peoples interest, which in turn relies upon their nature. Incentives are of course relative to the human mind.

[Kidlicious]

Humans avoid pain and seek pleasure. That is their nature. How they achieve that is complicated, but they are economic in nature.

[Drogue]

Yes, and how they achieve that is psychology. You're right, people are economic in nature, however the actions they take to achieve that are what affects politics, and is the psychology of the governed.

[Kidlicious]

The problem is arguing about psychological causes when the ultimate cause is economics. People generally (but not always) are National Socialists, or Libertarian, Communist or whatever because they have an economic interest in that ideology. The focus needs to be on economics, not psychology. What is the purpose of focusing on psychology?

[BeBMan]

Originally posted by Kidicious
The problem is arguing about psychological causes when the ultimate cause is economics. People generally (but not always) are National Socialists, or Libertarian, Communist or whatever because they have an economic interest in that ideology.

Why do you think that?

[Whaleboy]

Any motive is, by definition, psychological, like I said previously, economy works on our perception of money or resources which is in turn symbolic and relative. If I give you a million £ in a briefcase on a desert island with no hope of human contact ever again, all you have is firewood and several thousand bits of paper. Need/want, the rest of it... all psychological... the fact that our needs and wants differ in the same situation from person to person proves that any difference lies in our minds... psychology in other words.

[Spiffor]

I'm a Socialist, and my personal interest cannot be served by that ideology, as I am of comfortable middle-class ascent.

It is actually a documented fact that people's political opinions has more to do with their perceptions of general interest, than purely with their pocketbook. However, the affective attitudes are overwhelmingly superior to both pocketbook and "sociotropic" ones.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Spiffor
It is actually a documented fact that people's political opinions has more to do with their perceptions of general interest, than purely with their pocketbook.

How often do people concern themselves with general interest at the expense of their personal interest? Not often.