Simpsons Trainspotting

[Dis]

Originally posted by rah
except for kelsey grammer and david hyde pierce.

That one ranks up there as one of my favorites.
And the other Sideshow Bob ones are right up there too.
Or the Stonecutters.
It's when the celebrities play themselves, that's when there is a problem.

the difference there, is they weren't playing themselves.

Celebrities playing actual characters

celebrities playing themselves

[Wycoff]

I thought that last night's Simpsons was pretty good. The celeb cameos actually worked for this episode. Plus, that Donkey Kong tribute was great. As an additional bonus, they revealed Comic Book Guy's name.

I disagree with the opinions of most people on this thread. I'm also a long time Simpsons fan (been there since the Tracy Ulman shorts). I thought that the show went down hill a few years ago, with the nadir being the 2000-2001 season. However, IMO the show has begun an upswing, and has been more original and entertaining the past few seasons then it has been for a while.
The thing is that the nature of the show has changed. Its no longer really a cartoon poke at American family life centered around one family and its semi-realistic problems. The show has developed into a surrealistic experience centering around an entire town of bizarre characters. The title "The Simpsons" is by now a bit of a misnomer; calling it "Springfield" would perhaps be more appropriate. The change has resulted in a trade off: the show has lost most of its ability to connect with the audience in a personal way. Unlike in the past, there is now little left that most people can identify with. However, the show has gained a new abstract quality that has produced many bizarrely hillarious moments. It also focuses more on distinctly political commentary than it did in the past. True, its not as good as it was in its golden years (early to mid 90s), but I think that it has evolved into a different show, one that's still funny more often than not. Its still better than the vast majority of sitcoms/comedies that are on t.v. I realize that it has become a different show (its hard to maintain consistancy through a run of 350+ episodes), but I'm still glad that its on t.v. Its one of the few shows that I actually watch.

[Dis]

I think it peaked with who shot mr. burns.

[Seeker]

Death of Maude Flanders began the decline for me.

Not to mention that episode where Homer jumps a literal shark and the joke fell flat because of the episode's general lameness...

About the evolution...I think the 'Old Simpsons' was a quintessentially 90s phenomenon...the 'New Simpsons' is desperately trying to reconnect with a younger generation that has experienced Southpark and Family Guy.

Golden Age simpsons simply had a 90s 14-22 year old 'mentality' that doesn't exist as much in the younger generation of '05.

The younger generation of '05 grew up with a world divided into stark contrasts, warring political camps, and increasing stridency that has had it's effect on humour.

Some particulars to back this thesis:

-The Marge Influence: In Golden Age Simpsons, marge represented the bedrock of American small c conservative values. There were numerous instances where this was done and not mocked; 'don't make me choose between my man and my god'. In the New Simpsons, marge is made 'wilder', she can have bad aspects, and the Old Marge values are mocked.

-The 'moral messages' in general: In the Old Simpsons, despite the humour, there were 'Wally and the Beav' moments like all the religions coming together to put out the fire.

-The Homer as Everyman: Original Homer was an everyman, lazy, but in a 'joe six-pack/average guy' way, stupid, but well meaninged. New Homer is no longer Everyman, but merely extreme caricature. He is the obnoxious Fool, not the Fool-in-All these days.

-In the '05 world, the Simpsons relatively apolitical nature 'needed' to change and become more shrill, note the evolution of Ned Flanders: He became more and more of a shrill critique of a certain religious and conservative lifestyle/viewpoint, the transformation of caricature, into shrill, strident caricature.

It remains to be seen what will be the Simpsons true successor or even if such a thing is still possible.

[hexagonian]

Originally posted by rah
except for kelsey grammer and david hyde pierce.

That one ranks up there as one of my favorites.
And the other Sideshow Bob ones are right up there too.
Or the Stonecutters.
It's when the celebrities play themselves, that's when there is a problem.

It depends on how they are portrayed...

For instance, one of my favorite episodes of all time is the one with N'Sync. Now I do not care for boyband music in the least, but it is how N'Sync is presented that makes that one a howler to me. (and it helps that Ralphie Wiggum has a slew of hilarious lines in that one)

Same with REM ('Michael, no...that's not the REM way. Now let's recycle those shards and get out of here.')

Present the celebs with their goofy quirks and the formula works.

But I do agree - when the celebs play charaters (Fat Tony, Sideshow Bob...), the show is at its best. Sideshow Bob is still my all time favorite 'town' character on the show.

And yes, the show is getting a little long in the tooth. The oldies are still the best. Its been a good run though.

[Tattila the Hun]

Originally posted by Seeker
Death of Maude Flanders began the decline for me.

Eh, what happened to her?

[rah]

Originally posted by Seeker

-The Homer as Everyman: Original Homer was an everyman, lazy, but in a 'joe six-pack/average guy' way, stupid, but well meaninged. New Homer is no longer Everyman, but merely extreme caricature. He is the obnoxious Fool, not the Fool-in-All these days.

This sums up my feelings. Homer used to be the average (or below) guy. Sometimes a fool like all of us.

Now they focus on Homer being a baffoon, so it's harder to feel any sympathy or empathy for him.

[Wycoff]

Originally posted by rah
This sums up my feelings. Homer used to be the average (or below) guy. Sometimes a fool like all of us.

Now they focus on Homer being a baffoon, so it's harder to feel any sympathy or empathy for him.

Homer's transformation from dumb everyman to legendary baffoon is one of the central reasons why the Simpsons has transformed into a surrealistic comedy. The writers don't even have to worry about making plots realistic, they just put the character in strange situation and hope that hilarity ensues. Most of the times it does, sometimes it doesn't.

[rah]

Yes, that sums it up. I miss the old Homer. These days, they make a big issue about him never seeming to work.

And HEX

Originally posted by hexagonian
For instance, one of my favorite episodes of all time is the one with N'Sync. Now I do not care for boyband music in the least, but it is how N'Sync is presented that makes that one a howler to me. (and it helps that Ralphie Wiggum has a slew of hilarious lines in that one)

Yes there are exceptions. I like that one a lot too, for the same reason.

[Bkeela]

The Simpsons has always sucked. All the Simpson memes floating around bring me down. If I had a dollar for every chump I've heard 'woohoo' and 'd'oh' I would be a rich man.

[Whaleboy]

I want them not to suck, so badly! Homer^3 was the best cartoon moment of all time!