I Miss Republicans

[Ned]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


He sold arms to an enemy of the United States that we were actively fighting, Iran. In the Constitution, we have a word for that. It's called treason.

Idiot.

The "scandal" was about what happened to the money.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Oerdin
I am utterly amazed that some people don't seem to know the depths of the true crimes commited in Watergate & Iran-Contra. I am at a complete lose for words.

I know about Watergate and agree Nixon had to go.

I strongly disagree about Iran Contra. Here, I agree that North was the hero and the Dems in Congress were the criminals.

[Ned]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara

Originally posted by The Mad Monk
The only difference between Watergate and Whitewater is that Clinton's associates were better at stonewalling.*

There is no evidence that the Clintons did anything illegal. Even if they had done something, it was before he became President, while he was Governor. Unlike Nixon, who committed his crimes as President.

Well, he did lie under oath. The major problem with this is not so much that he was president, but that he was a lawyer. This is why, I believe, Starr was so made at Clinton.

As to his lies to the American people and his staff about Lewinsky, I understand that and never held it against him.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Agathon

How do we get back to the days where our biggest concern was executive blowjobs? I liked that world better.

The anti-semite Republicans probably only made a fuss about that because she was Jewish (before they got their "we love Israel" thing [i.e. when the Apocalypse comes God will sort out those ****s, but for now we need them to fulfil the prophecy]).

On the latter point. It speaks volumes that the Israeli government should support an American party whose most fanatical supporters want to see God set fire to all the Jews that don't start crying Jesus.

Lewinsky was Jewish?

[Agathon]

Lewinsky was Jewish?

[Last Conformist]

Originally posted by Ned

The "scandal" was about what happened to the money.

So, selling weapons to a regime that called for the destruction of America is all kinky by you?

[Dinner]

Ned, Reagan was knee deep in the whole Iran-Contra affair at least if you believe Oliver North who I admite is a known perjurier and felon. The Reagon administration needed to raise money to help fund the anti-communist Contra movement in Central America but the Congress passed laws limiting the export of weapons and the giving of US tax payer money to known mass murders and drug dealers. Thus was born the plan to help the Contras sell Cocaine in order to raise money while selling weapons to Iran (who was in the middle of a war against Iraq). Both the trafficing in Cocaine and the sales of weapons were illegal and all the funds were given to the Contras who had the nasty habit of executing just about everyone who disagreed with them.

This is all well documented and was in the final Congressional report.

[Odin]

Ned, I didn't know you hated america so much.

Ollie North is a traitor, he gave aid and comfort to our enemies (Iran). That is defined as treason by the Constitution.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Last Conformist

So, selling weapons to a regime that called for the destruction of America is all kinky by you?

Reagan apparently was trying to get diplomatic relations with the Ayatollah back to normal. Regardless, the president is in charge of foreign relations and what he does is not "traitorous."

[Ned]

Originally posted by Oerdin
Ned, Reagan was knee deep in the whole Iran-Contra affair at least if you believe Oliver North who I admite is a known perjurier and felon. The Reagon administration needed to raise money to help fund the anti-communist Contra movement in Central America but the Congress passed laws limiting the export of weapons and the giving of US tax payer money to known mass murders and drug dealers. Thus was born the plan to help the Contras sell Cocaine in order to raise money while selling weapons to Iran (who was in the middle of a war against Iraq). Both the trafficing in Cocaine and the sales of weapons were illegal and all the funds were given to the Contras who had the nasty habit of executing just about everyone who disagreed with them.

This is all well documented and was in the final Congressional report.

Reagan authorized the sale of weapons to Iran. Nothing was said about what to do with the proceeds. Ollie himself testified that using the money to fund the Contras was his bright idea.

Obviously, we differ on the Contras. They were former regime elements that were conducting a resistance to a communist takeover. Something like Iraq. But since they were resisting communism, it was right for us to back the Contras.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Odin
Ned, I didn't know you hated america so much.

Ollie North is a traitor, he gave aid and comfort to our enemies (Iran). That is defined as treason by the Constitution.

Bull. Ollie had nothing to do with the decision to sell weapons to Iran. That was Reagan. Ollie used the weapons money to fund the Contras. What he did was "unauthorized." Still, Ollie was right.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Ned
Reagan apparently was trying to get diplomatic relations with the Ayatollah back to normal. Regardless, the president is in charge of foreign relations and what he does is not "traitorous."

Except Congress and Carter had already signed sanctions laws against Iran outlawing the sale of Arms. There were export controls in place and Reagan arranged to illegally sell arms to a country which has all official government sessions start and end with the chant "death to America".

On the Contras let us leave out the politics for one moment and forget the death squads. Even if we ignore politics is it right for people in the employment of the US government to fly cocaine into the US to raise money for the Contras? They were flying US owned planes and the pilots were paid by our government. That's government run drug smuggling which Reagan, North, and Bush Sr all kknew about. North was the one who set it up because he wanted to help the Contras raise money.

That's just plain criminal.

[Gatekeeper]

I am a moderate Republican — socially moderate, fiscally conservative — so my conscious is clear. I voted a split ticket in November — some Republicans, some Democrats, all people I figured had their heads screwed on straight. Bush was not among the Republicans I voted for.

If there had been a viable third-party candidate at any level (local, state, national), I likely would've given him or her a shot ... but that pretty much a desert this time around. Perhaps they'll have more of a presence in future elections.

Am I a "bad" Republican? If it means liking John McCain, Olympia Snowe and other level-headed folks, then you're damn right I'm bad. Down to the core bad. If it means giving Medicare the ability to negotiate for the prices it pays for prescription drugs, then, hell yes, I'm a twisted, evil bad Republican. If it means calling Bush's bluff when it comes to Social Security "reform" — oh, yes, I just want to "take a chance" with private investment that, given the current formula, might mean I take home a supplemental monthly check of $50 to $200 a month after retirement in addition to the SS check (but don't tell anyone that the SS check would be cut by a corresponding or greater amount) — then count me in as a "bad" Republican.

Damn blog has it right. The reactionaries have taken over — and not just in the good ole USA Republican Party, IMO — and woe to the world for what's to come. The meek shall indeed inherit the Earth ... but before a third of humanity lies dead.

*cough* Eh, yes, a bit of pessimism there. It happens after you've been a "bad" Republican for awhile.

Gatekeeper

[Last Conformist]

Originally posted by Ned


Reagan apparently was trying to get diplomatic relations with the Ayatollah back to normal. Regardless, the president is in charge of foreign relations and what he does is not "traitorous."

I do not believe I've used the word "traitorous" ...

You did not answer my question. Is it, according to you, acceptable that a US president sells weapons to a regime that calls for the destruction of America?

[Commy]

Screw elephants and donkeys...


ANARCHY