Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Social Security yet again!

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #31
    Originally posted by GePap


    What deficit?
    The anticipated one. Not reffering to the current situation.
    "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

    Comment


    • #32
      Krugman is torching a strawman, as always. The proposed system will be nothing like the British system.

      Many Britons were sold badly designed retirement plans on false pretenses. Companies guilty of "mis-selling" were eventually forced to pay about $20 billion in compensation. Fraud aside, the fees paid to financial managers have been a major problem: "Reductions in yield resulting from providers' charges," the Pensions Commission says, "can absorb 20-30 percent of an individual's pension savings."
      The system contemplated will have extremely low annual management fees (on the order of 0.1% of the principle per annum) and will be based on index funds -- i.e., your returns will follow the returns of the overall market. The only way your account could go bust if is the entire market dissolved.

      Government workers have this system (called the Thrift Savings Plan) and it has been proven to be very good. Here are the funds available...

      – Government Securities Investment (G) Fund
      – Fixed Income Index Investment (F) Fund
      – Common Stock Index Investment (C) Fund
      – Small Capitalization Stock Index Investment (S) Fund
      – International Stock Index Investment (I) Fund
      Last edited by DanS; January 14, 2005, 16:45.
      I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

      Comment


      • #33
        Source for that claim?
        If you don't like reality, change it! me
        "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
        "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
        "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

        Comment


        • #34
          See, for example, the Social Security Administration's FAQ about Social Security's future...



          Q: What is a voluntary personal retirement account?

          A. There are many possible ways to structure personal accounts. Several proposals recommend that a personal savings account plan for Social Security be modeled after the federal government's Thrift Savings Plan. This very popular plan for federal employees and members of Congress allows a choice of five highly diversified, low-cost mutual funds. In the Thrift Savings Plan, no direct investments in individual stocks are allowed.
          Trust me. This is the proposal. There are no others being seriously contemplated.
          I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

          Comment


          • #35
            from same site:

            How big is the future problem?

            Social Security is not sustainable over the long term at present benefit and tax rates without large infusions of additional revenue. There will be a massive and growing shortfall over the 75-year period.

            Social Security's Chief Actuary projects that in present-value dollars the total net Social Security cash flow for years 2004 through 2078 is projected to be nearly -$5.2 trillion. When the trust fund balances of $1.5 trillion at the beginning of 2004 are added to this value, we get a financial shortfall (or unfunded obligation) for the 75-year period of $3.7 trillion. This unfunded obligation indicates that if an additional $3.7 trillion had been added to the trust fund at the beginning of 2004, the program would have had adequate financing to meet the projected cost of benefits scheduled in current law over the next 75




            For the 75 year period! Of 3.7 Trillion! As was stated before, that is about 50 billion a year! OMG! That is utterly unsustainable! At If current defense spending went forward, in the next 75 years we will spend 30 trillion on military spending......

            Damn, this administration is absurd.
            If you don't like reality, change it! me
            "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
            "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
            "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

            Comment


            • #36
              A) The UNRISD can hardly be considered a friend of free marketeers

              B) Likewise the same can be said for CENDA.

              Given that these are the credentials of this man one strongly wonders whether his biases are more than clouding his article.


              C) I love how you made sure not to reference the bottom part of the paper that speaks to a mixed private-public system which I believe is the intent of the US.

              namely
              The savings in the AFP system—duly reformed to impose serious competition and lower costs—may conform to a good, complementary, second tier in a Chilean pension system that in the end will be recognized not as a private one, but a mixed public-private one.
              Now I really need to go and wash up. I feel dirty after looking at a Lyndon Larouche web site. uggg..
              "Just puttin on the foil" - Jeff Hanson

              “In a democracy, I realize you don’t need to talk to the top leader to know how the country feels. When I go to a dictatorship, I only have to talk to one person and that’s the dictator, because he speaks for all the people.” - Jimmy Carter

              Comment


              • #37
                Once that $3.7 trillion is put into future dollars instead of current dollars, the number skyrockets.

                But in any event, you don't actually think that we could come up with an extra $3.7 trillion this year, do you?
                I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

                Comment


                • #38
                  How does your first part, that this guy is biased, square with him writing what he does at the end??

                  Thought, if you note, he states that this mixed system would remain a secondary one to the fullu public pension system.

                  Make sure to wash your brain while you shower, there seem to be some spiderwebs up there.
                  If you don't like reality, change it! me
                  "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
                  "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
                  "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by DanS
                    Once that $3.7 trillion is put into future dollars instead of current dollars, the number skyrockets.
                    So does the price of gum., you point??

                    But in any event, you don't actually think that we could come up with an extra $3.7 trillion this year, do you?
                    Why the **** would we have to come up with 3.7 trillion this year, if 50 billion a year would keep the system up?

                    If you don't like reality, change it! me
                    "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
                    "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
                    "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by GePap
                      Thought, if you note, he states that this mixed system would remain a secondary one to the fullu public pension system.
                      Much akin to the proposed plan by Bush and according to the DanS figures with builtin caps of mangement fees.

                      No plan has been posited yet that I am aware of that calls for complete privatization or even majority portion privatization.

                      Now get your panties unbunched and move on.
                      "Just puttin on the foil" - Jeff Hanson

                      “In a democracy, I realize you don’t need to talk to the top leader to know how the country feels. When I go to a dictatorship, I only have to talk to one person and that’s the dictator, because he speaks for all the people.” - Jimmy Carter

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by DanS
                        Once that $3.7 trillion is put into future dollars instead of current dollars, the number skyrockets.
                        Wouldn't current contributions be subject to the same math?
                        "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

                        Comment


                        • #42


                          And then why all the talk about "letting people chose"?

                          You Ogie are one of these "reasonable" republicans that has constantly underestimated the insanity of our current rulers.
                          If you don't like reality, change it! me
                          "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
                          "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
                          "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by GePap


                            And then why all the talk about "letting people chose"?

                            You Ogie are one of these "reasonable" republicans that has constantly underestimated the insanity of our current rulers.
                            Because people like choices. Why are you so authoritarian that you deny them that?
                            "Just puttin on the foil" - Jeff Hanson

                            “In a democracy, I realize you don’t need to talk to the top leader to know how the country feels. When I go to a dictatorship, I only have to talk to one person and that’s the dictator, because he speaks for all the people.” - Jimmy Carter

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe


                              Because people like choices. Why are you so authoritarian that you deny them that?
                              Because making sure everyone gets a basic minimum of funds is the most important part of a pension system. We don't give people a "choice" of fire departments, or police departments, or militaries. You authoritarian scum
                              If you don't like reality, change it! me
                              "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
                              "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
                              "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                I'd like a "choice" when it comes to a lot of things... like I want a different president, congress, supreme court... hell, I think we should give people choices in every aspect of society! THAT WOULD BE AWESOME!
                                To us, it is the BEAST.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X