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**LordStone1** · November 18, 2000, 21:04

Interesting. A win in 1906 - pretty quick game, I'd say.

**Shadowstrike** · November 18, 2000, 21:48

EOG: This was my first Dip game, and I went in without a clue what was going on... After checking out the tutorial, I got a basic grasp of the rules, but I went to the bookstore anyhow to see if I could get a hint or two. Anyhow, I found a few good ideas, and put together some pretty good opening moves. I allied with Russia and France, and plotted to do away with Austria... With a stab by Bearcat, it looked liked Austria might defeat me, but I held on and won. In that time, I was also plotting with France against England. I scored a SC out of that plan, which was mostly executed by HsFB. By the time that Austria had been vanquished, Russia was preparing to sweep over the world. I knew that my alliance was long gone, so I prepared a "Magniot Line". Suprisingly, I held out several turns against Scott's determined assult. Then, he took the Baltic sea, and Denmark. From that point on, I was doomed. He swept over Berlin and the rest of Germany. I stuggled to keep hold, but it was already too late.

**End EOG**

Oh and if it matters, Vie retreats to Tri and Kie to Hol.

**Bearcat** · November 19, 2000, 17:40

EOG: This was not my first ever Dip experience so I had some idea what I was doing. My biggest mistake was probably reading the help site that Boshko provided a link too. I became obsessed that Turkey was my enemy and I needed to finish them off. Thus I tried to formulate an alliance between myself, Austria, and Russia against Turkey. However this was a mistkae since I spread myself thin and didn't get builds whatsoever out of the deal. After Turkey's death was pretty much guaranteed I swung back to Italy. However I spent most of the time building and preparing to attack France. However when HsFB stabbed Shadowstrike I realized this wasn't going to happen how I had planned it so I attacked him early.

**N35t0r** · November 20, 2000, 09:08

EOGs:
First of all: I DID NOT backstab Shadowstrike. I was trying to help with the front.

Barbarossa: I am glad the game ended before you did, i really didn't expect you to backstab me , taking in acount Scott was about to win. We might have driven him back...
I finally figured a good strategy for Italy(yesterday). It's the best one i've thought of so far, and works best with diplomacy. (i managed without, anyway)

It's been my first DIP game against humans, exept for a computer one including Dr_Strangelove, me and the AI.
I had no clear strategy at the beginning, and did not read anything. As against the AI you can't do diplomacy, i usually (being france) attack germany and england. Then, when i have a big enough army, spare some to go south.
In the start of the game i welcomed Barbarossa's alliance, as i could now spare the two units i usually left down there, and found an alliance with Shadowstrike quite useful, including his idea to conquer England.
Operation Sealion was held back by Mishipman's temporary conquest of Denmark and one of the Low Countries, and the turn in which i couldn't submit the orders on time, but it finally was completed. This helped Scott as he managed to take norway.
By that time, i already had plans with Scott to divide Germany between us, and completely ignored Turkey's advice against Russia, Italy and Austria, mainly due to my alliance with Bearcat.
When Scott backstabbed the Austrian player (sorry, i forgot who it was), i realized he had become too powerful, as Bearcat had failed to make any gains down there or even care about scott's growing power, and re-thought my plans. As i tried to get my forces to the scandinavian SCs, and urging Barbarossa to attack Scott, which did not happen, i encountered several difficulties regarding the German fleet at Edi and did not manage to do this in time. I should have not let him take Edi.

i guess that's it.

**N35t0r** · November 20, 2000, 09:14

Oh, yes...

It's been a great game, and congrats to you, Scott.

**Shadowstrike** · November 20, 2000, 21:31

I guess I was more of the "vulture" in the invasion of England... I just sat back, and let HsFB do all the grunt work while I took "my" share... Honestly, if you took it first, I would have been quite content with just the low countries...

**Scott F** · November 21, 2000, 06:45

Well, let's see. Where to begin.

First of all, this was a good game, and I had fun with it.

Now, on to the EOG:

At the start of the game, I talked to pretty much everyone and tried to be friendly. I arranged for a Black Sea DMZ with Turkey, a Gal DMZ with Austria, and a Pru-Sil DMZ with Germany. Along the way, I learned that both Austria and Germany, both of whom I was hoping to be allied to, were planning to kill each other.

At the start, my only real goals were to get three builds in the first turn, Rum, Nor, and Swe. I pretty much succeeded. Turkey repeatedly broke our DMZ agreement, and after a while I got tired of him and the Cossack brigades headed south. Turkey did not fall easily. Had Austria and Germany not been stalemated and at war, I probably would not have succeeded in killing Turkey so quickly, nd I might have been destroyed by an attack from the west while trying to kill the sultan.

While dying, Turkey lashed out in all directions, stabbing Austria at Ser and making a mad dash for Tun. Turkey's deathrattle was the straw that broke Austria's back. The disband caused by the loss of Ser resulted in the end of the Bohemian stalemate that had paralyzed both Germany and Austria for so long. The Cossack brigades were ready, and were able to sweep in and snatch Bud as Dual Monarchy collapsed. To the south, the last bastions of Turkish power in the Eastern Mediterranean were crushed with the fall of Gre.

Now, with Turkey smashed and Austria gone, I was suddenly in a supreme position in the game. Italy traded compliance for survival, and managed to gain centers like Trieste in the process. to the north, England was taking a beating, nearly dead, but not quite. With the French and the Germans busy with England and Germany still recovering from the duel with Austria, I struck out to win the game. My forces in Scandinavia, which had been holding and supporting each other since the first couple of game turns (which might have been forgotten by practically everyone), descended into Den. The arrival of a fleet into Bal and forces into Pru sealed Germany's fate, just as France, ever the vulture, decided to jump in and grab a chunk of Germany.

With the forces piling up in the east, I swung in with a two pronged attack into Ber and Sil that turned out to be a lot more clever than I thought it would be, as it not only succeeded but destroyed two German armies in the process. More importantly, by controlling Sil, I could now break the once impervious Boh-Vie barrier, which had been used by Austria to hold off the Germans and was now being used by the Germans to hold me off. From there on in, it was pretty much on autopilot. Thinking that I still had to get three centers, I went for Kie in a three unit attack, and used Sil to break the support from Boh to Vie, enabling the Cossack brigades to enter Vienna.

When I submitted the moves for the last turn, I was fearful that France might not actually be stabbing Germany (having not grabbed two centers the fall before when they had the chance). I was afraid that France might attack into Sil or support Boh, thwarting my plans. I knew that I could get Kie, so I threw everything at it, expecting to be thwarted at Vie somehow. I was surprised when Boshko told me that I won. I thought that I still had a couple of supply centers to go.

Anyway, it was a great game.

**CyberGnu** · November 21, 2000, 14:22

Shadowstrike, a friendly tip for your next game: As germany, never ever attack Austria unless you have already deeated russia.

Germany already have three enemies on three fronts, it just can't afford another one. Furthermore, there is an 'invisible line' crossing the board, through StP/Mos-Liv/Mos-Liv/War-Pru/War-Sil/War-Sil/Gal-Sil/Boh-Mun/Boh-Mun/Tyr-Swi-Mar/Pie. This effectively divides the board into two separate game boards.

In the early game, you usually don't have to worry about attacks over this line. This means that Austria seldom, if ever, attacks Germany. The two main exeptions are a Russian stab on Germany or a Franco/Italian war. Both these are fairly uncommon in the early game.

Umm, maybe this was too much theory... Anyway, the lessons is pretty simple. Germany needs Austria to protect its back from the Russian...

------------------
Gnu Ex Machina - the Gnu in the Machine

**Bearcat** · November 21, 2000, 20:33

So now you're all high and mighty Scott? I never "traded compliance for survival". I was under the impression we had an alliance.

**Dave Boshko** · November 21, 2000, 20:41

Bearcat: It's usually not a good idea to "ally" with a country that much bigger than yourself and Scott F.'s characterization of the relationship sounds pretty accurate to me

oh and CyberGnu is very very right

**Shadowstrike** · November 21, 2000, 21:46

I guess that I should have reconsidered trying to kill of Austria. But then again, WarVoid was just as stubborn as I was and we were quickly at each others's (virtual) necks.

I was actually planning to try to break Russia before Turkey totally fell, but I could never muster the forces to. Once Scott broke the defence line, I was a dead duck, I could not adequately support all of my armies. I thought that I could hold off Russia, while forces slipped in the "back door" of Scandanavia, but I was wrong. Scott broke though and won... I guess we should have listened to Nap's warnings.

**N35t0r** · November 22, 2000, 07:34

We might have stopped Scott.

Cyber Gnu is right, and that's why i didn't pay attention to Nap's advice: having an alliance with Bearcat, i frankly was too much occupied with England to care about the Eastern Mediterranean.

First i should have found a way to discuss strategy before my moves were submitted, esp. with orders due on mondays/tuesdays. This could have made ShadowStrike survive some more. Of course, with Bearcat stabbing my back down there it wouldn't have helped for long.

I also should have took Edi, which would have enabled my fleet to reach Scandinavia earlier, as our fleets got stuck up there.

**Bearcat** · November 22, 2000, 15:29

No not in the least. I didn't ICQ Scott begging him at the very beggining to let me survive. Instead I tried to trick him into helping me eliminate Turkey. Which he did all to well I don't think it happened the way he described it. And after that we agreed that I would stab France and that he would take out Austria and Germany.

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Apprentice Dip Fall 1906 Results (Scott F. Wins!)

Apprentice Dip Fall 1906 Results (Scott F. Wins!)

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