Red Front 1.4 is here!

[Captain Nemo]

I just released version 1.4 after 2 months of work and testplay. It will be on StLeo's site and Alex's War Gallery shortly. I also sent it to CSC but I'm not sure that site is being updated anymore?

This is going to be it for Red Front upgrades for a while... (Although I have many more ideas!) I will be working with John Petroski on "Austieg" and complete an update of 2194 Days of War.

For those who haven't played Red Front here is a screenshot of Operation Citadel(Battle of Kursk)in 1943



And here is the "Soviet Tank Park"...As you can see there are quite a few units with different statistics and capabilites: Military tech development plays a major role in the game. Note also the summer and winter versions of some tanks.




And another screenshot from the scenario



[This message has been edited by Captain Nemo (edited March 18, 2000).]
[This message has been edited by Captain Nemo (edited April 03, 2000).]
[This message has been edited by Captain Nemo (edited April 27, 2000).]

[Djugashvili]

HUGE Problem #1 Remains!!

October 1941: 'Too many units! A new unit cannot be created in the game. Try disbanding some.'
I thought this was fixed! It's v e r y irritating seeing this message after getting into a game... it's disastrous for gameplay, as well. Instead of releasing a whole new version to fix this, Nemo, could you just describe on this forum how to edit the events file and have people fix it for themselves? This HAS to be solved if I'm ever to play the scenario again...

[St Leo]

My site is in the process of being redesigned, so I suggest you rely on Alex for the moment.

------------------
St. Leo
http://ziggurat.sidgames.com/
http://www.sidgames.com/forums/

[DarthVeda]

Nemo, Can I try developing a German version of this scenario after I finish Rising Sun?

[Captain Nemo]

Djugashvili: Here is what the issue is with the "Too many units"...:

The game is not too near the maximum number of units allowed when you start (Approx. 1600 vs max 2048?). However, the German strategy of 1941, which is one of the key elements of the game and gives the "unstoppable German war machine" feel relies on creating units progressively nearer to the front line. This is done by events triggered by the killing of units...

So depending on your game strategy those numbers can vary greatly. I reduced the numbers in play at the beginning of the game significantly since version 1.3 and neither myself nor other testplayers ran into the problem with 1.4... However I cannot test every style of play. If a lot of fighting goes on early on and the German lose a bunch of units they recreate them in greater numbers and before you know it you're over the limit again. Taking off another 50 starting units won't help that much if you play an aggressive style in 1941... On the other hand if I reduce the unit creation events, there won't be enough to achieve historical results in 1941 if you play a "defensive" style and pull units Eastward ahead of the Germans.

As you can see there is no easy fix! Otherwise I would have done it.

I already significantly reduced defending units in Western German cities since they aren't needed until 1944.

One factor that helps: The problem goes away by Dec 1941 because Germans stop creating units at such a high rate. I have never seen the problem in 1942 in any version. You could eliminate a few more German starting units from each of the "large" stacks in Eastern Poland without risking to affect gameplay too much.
Also cut out more of the defending units in Western Germany. (But many cities already are down to 1 or 2 defenders).

BTW, most of the changes in 1.4 were not to fix this problem but rather to improve the late gameplay in 1944-45.
[This message has been edited by Captain Nemo (edited March 19, 2000).]

[Aivopuoliso]

Is the scenario available for download somewhere?

[Captain Nemo]

I sent it to StLeo and Alex yesterday... They have yet to place it on their sites. I sent it in parallel to a number of gamers who requested it so that's how they have it already.

[Aivopuoliso]

OK...

[Captain Nemo]

DarthVeda:
You're welcome to do it. Remember John Petroski is making a new "Austieg" which will include the attack on the Soviet Union, changes of seasons and many of the Red Front graphics... and new ones that I am making right now.

[klesh]

Djugashvili,
The Captain speaks the truth. I ran into this with 1.3 recently whilst trying to pump out Labor Brigades for the Urals. I got the "Too Many Units" thins about 25 times per turn and it lasted for about 4 turns!!!!
So I got on Apolyton and posted the situation. Followed Nemo's advice of "play on" and sure enough, in a few turns (Winter'41) the problem was gone. It didn't even really effect the industrialization too much either. It's now '44 and the Germans are on the ropes
Check with your foriegn minister to see just how many units the Germans have...you'll begin to see their decline. But they start with like 1600 units!
To think how hard this would be to defend against if the "AI" had any "I" in it!!!!

[Djugashvili]

Well, guess what?

The too many units thing only came up once, in Oct41. It never showed up again, at least as far as I have played so far. I did disband some of the Red Army units in the very well fortified cities, and often reduced garrisons in Ural cities to 3, the maximum for martial law. So I'm happy now

But I have noticed this version is alot harder, even on the emperor level I played on. After the first winter, it didn't look too good... The Germans bombed lots of my laborers and I was dissapointed when they beat down Leningrad and Rostov to virtually nothing one turn after the snow had melted!! I'm gonna start a new game soon to see if I can overcome this somehow... I'll keep you posted, Nemo...

[MarkG]

nemo, can you send your scenario to svenm@apolyton.net??
check this page first http://apolyton.net/civ2/db/submitfile.shtml

thanks

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Markos, Apolyton Civilization Site

[Djugashvili]

So Nemo, what you're saying is is that I should just wait the few extra turns without building any units until December, then the problem should go away? I'll do that, just as long as the problem doesn't spill over into other parts of the scenario...

[Mao]

yeah, send it to apolyton, 'bout time they get some good scenarios there (no offense) sure the server's big enough markos? it's 5 sections

[Djugashvili]

Wow... Summer 42 is MUCH harder than before. It used to be that if you made it through the initial summer, you were on a path to victory, but the next one is even HARDER!! Although I managed to put up a good fight, it all fell apart by August. Leningrad and Rostov were captured. Operation Blau was a success; not in the fact that they captured Stalingrad, but that it managed to open the door for a Caucasus offensive. That new city between Stalingrad and Rostov took some punishment!!

Anyways, I got discouraged when all this happened even when I played on emperor level. The Germans were sneaking through the holes and attacking Ural cities! It was a mess... I was pleased with my progress through the first two parts of the scenario, and I thought I was safe, but all hell broke loose...

Three cheers for Komrade Nemo!!