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**Djugashvili** · December 25, 1999, 17:57

Anybody?

**Cam** · December 25, 1999, 18:22

What's the game objective, and who are the tribes? I guess it's well set up for the traditional objectives of (a.) bloodlust in the name of unification, and (b.) space race. Are you going to be pursuing a Jules Verne type technology-based scenario? Think about the reasons as to why people will be attracted to the scenario in the first place? And "OK - what are your bright ideas?"

**Djugashvili** · December 25, 1999, 19:39

Alright, I'm glad someone asked.

I planned on making the scenario somewhat technological, the main goal would be to maintain a vast country with many ethnic groups and juggle foreign issues. It would be a combo of colonization(early), industrialization(early middle), research(late middle), and diplomacy(late) to see how long you could keep the USSR intact. The main conflicts would mostly be related to internal strife with small conquests possibly being made, but it wouldn't be easy. But if you think you could go for total domination, go right ahead. A very open-endeed scenario.

I started a map consisting of most of the soviet union, europe, and across a contracted Atlantic, there would be the East Us and Cuba, but I'm not sure I have to amke my own. The tribes would be:
-Soviet Union of course
-United States
-British Commonwealth
-East Europe
-West Europe
-Mid East
-Other
Barbarians=Independant States

There would be a special unit called 'Soviet Influence' or something that would be created through events that would 'capture' cities in e. europe after ww2, making them satellite states. Later, barbarians would get the same kind of units that could capture cities in the Soviet Bloc and claim independance if certain goals are not met by the human player.

I have somemore Ideas, and if anybody wants to hear them, post a message.

WOULD ANYBODY LIKE TO PLAY THIS????

**Cam** · December 25, 1999, 20:13

Sounds very ambitious - best of luck with it!
I had assumed that you were dividing the USSR into its states (Russia, Belarus, Kazakhstan, etc.), as the various tribes, and not taking on this semi-global approach. Thanks for clarifying that. China and Japan I guess would be included as 'other'?

As the A.I. hates 'world peace', I guess that you'll have a challenge in maintaining a defined plot that will see certain nations or national communities behave certain ways at certain times. Are you trying to replicate history, or will it take on a somewhat fictional tone (a kind of 'what if...?' scenario)?

If you've got more ideas that you'll like to report, I, for one, would be interested.

**Hendrik the Great** · December 25, 1999, 20:18

I reallt would like to play it. It sounds very interesting! I don't think there are many scenarios that look upon the world from that angle.

Change as much as possible!
It would be nice to see good new graphics.
But really good ones would do, too.

How will you reflect the indepence of all the colonies? By Barbarian attacks?
Have you thought about to include China? Afterall it is and was h u g e...
How will you include the WW2?

To implement the Space Race is a must I would say! And don't forget about that Cuban Missile Crisis!

Good luck and happy civing!

Oh, and Merry Christmas! Even if it is a bit late now...

**Djugashvili** · December 25, 1999, 20:24

I suppose I could perhaps divide the USSR into different countries, but that would mean that the Communist Party wouldn't control the whole state, resulting in unrealism. I was also planning on leaving China a Japan out of the map.

I think the plot would be pretty historically accurate up to a certain point in history, and then it would be up to you to see how long you can maintain stability.

I was thinking of dividing the game into several portions all with different files a la Red Front to allow much more detail. If Komrade Nemo(as I now call him)could reply to this post telling me how he did the DOS prompt thingy with the events and all, that would be greatly appreciated.

Anyway, yeah. I could divide it into Early Years, the Stalin Era, the Khrushchev Era, and then a few more, then the Post-Berlin Wall era or something, considering it ever falls...

Very ambitious, I know, but I can't pull it off without YOU! Post ideas unitl I tell you to stop! Not just Cam, EVERYBODY!!!

**Djugashvili** · December 25, 1999, 20:30

Hey, another post already!
Yeah, Hendrik, I was planning on the Space Race and the Cuban Missile Crisis being involved, but I'm not sure I can maintain the level of detail I want on the map w/ China included.

Don't worry; I am a severe advocator of changing things. In my past attempts at a scenario (which were postponed indefinatley for reasons I'd rather not discuss), I changed all the icons, units, advice files, rules, city lists, labels, and anything else I could find. Don't worry about the change; worry about the actual artwork. I want to do my own art, but I suck. I still need help...

Like I said, I plan to skip over WW2. You wanta good WW2 in russia scenario, go directly to Red Front. Period.

Finally, Yes, Independence would be from barbarian attacks.
[This message has been edited by Djugashvili (edited December 25, 1999).]

**Cam** · December 25, 1999, 21:13

Djugashvili,

Thanks for your quick response.

Sino influence

You can always create barbarian units I guess to represent the occasional conflict with the Chinese and still use events to outline the impact of Chairman Mao et al.

Internal relations

Just an idea, but I think that you could do away with the British and include them with Western Europe / Allied / NATO (and merge Canada with the USA to create a North American tribe) - leaving an extra nation for use. You could then have a 'Northern USSR' and a 'Southern USSR' that are allied-worshipful (also use good friendly slots - e.g. the Babylonians'). It would be in the player's best interest to keep this alliance alive for various reasons. If they were ever to go to war, the effects could be felt by Wonders going obsolete, terrain modifications, negative change money events, and so on. Just a thought.

**Djugashvili** · December 25, 1999, 21:18

Some good ideas, Cam, but how would the SSRs be split? North and South SSRs have no historical connections (i.e., they were never designated as such). And what about the times when all the countries of Europe weren't allied? What about when NATO was only a twinkle in FDR's eye? Remember, this should start around 1922; the world was alot different back then.

Very constructive, though. Excellent Progress I can see already

------------------
"When You Kill One, It Is A Tragedy. When You Kill 10 Million, It Is A Statistic"
-Comrade Stalin

**Hendrik the Great** · December 25, 1999, 22:03

You could in order to show the internal struggle leave out all wonders and technologies that make people happy and then, perhaps after renaming them, make them primary research goals. Or on the right time make a happy wonder obsolete which would result in massive to total unrest in the population. It would cause havoc in the economy, too if it goes on long enough. Say a few cities would remain calm(by wonder or so), thus loyal to the state, and could then send in troops to the rebelling cities to install marshal law.
Furthermore, rebels could pop up near the cities in unrest.

Make keeping the people happy very difficult by using the appropiate technologies and wonders.

To split the USSR make sure a barbarian unit captures the capitol of it. Then there would be real civil war.
You would have to modefy the other civs slots and there could only be 6 civs so the USSR can split.

**Djugashvili** · December 25, 1999, 22:08

Hendrik! That is BRILLIANT! You are my new Commissar of Intelligence. Keep 'em comin'...

**Cam** · December 26, 1999, 00:56

Djugashvili,

Thanks for your feedback.

It kind of depends upon the structure of the scenario that you make as to how some of these matters are handled.

As for having an alliance with an A.I. tribe, it's my understanding that there were some pretty significant cultural rifts within the USSR, not the least of which being the areas to the south-west that had an Islamic tradition. It was this specifically that I had in mind. Also, when the revolution came, I thought that there was a 'red' faction and a 'white' faction? With that said, my poor knowledge of Soviet history borders on the laughable - so I'll take your lead on any of these historical issues. Anyway, I thought it may be of value to have an A.I. tribe to ally with so you can exchange tech's, maps, and other benefits. As before, just a thought.

**Djugashvili** · December 26, 1999, 01:50

What you are saying makes alot of sense to me...I have some of reckoning to do. Perhaps, instead of making seperate civs for the different cultures of the Soviet Union, I could make different units, wonders, techs?? Or maybe I COULD split the USSR...

Oh, and this scenario presumably starts after the revolution of 1917, after the 'whites' are defeated, so they aren't a factor.
[This message has been edited by Djugashvili (edited December 26, 1999).]

**Fast_Eddie** · December 26, 1999, 02:48

Hmmmm....interesting....this idea reminds me a lot of a scenario I was playtesting about Caesar's Empire from Civfan. Here's what I think....

1. Use TOT for the map switching ability. This way, you can have a map that has the different tribes you must conquer first, and later switch to a larger map that represents the foreign nations you must deal with. The only problem is the names of the Nations later on.

2. Since this would be a multiple-part scenario, you automatically have to use the extra space provided with multiple files. The unification portion should, IMHO, be controlled through events by sending the player on "Missions" through each future Socialist Republic. I'm not the most accurate historian...but perhaps even sending the player on a mission that is doomed to fail (perhaps in the east or south?), just to add a little something to it.

3. After the unification part, things should be less restraining, allowing the player to do whatever he/she (If there are any... ) would like to achieve in foriegn policies. Industrialization should definately be a path to take, and you could rename Marketplaces and Banks to things like Mills and Processiing Plants so that you could make money instead of just added production. Wonders would definately help here too.

4. I think that for the countries, there should be,

Soviet Union
United States
Germany + Italy
Britain + France
China
Arabs/Muslims
Neutrals
Hindus (Dunno what else you need)
Barbs (for events or just cheap things to take in Eastern Europe)

5. The map you could use could be the North Pole map that Mike D and I were using for a Cold War scenario we were making together. That would show all the countries you would need to show for international relations.

6. Definately make WWII avoidable! It would be very tough to simulate on a map that shows so many countries. You could start it if you wanted to, but I DEFINATELY would not reccomend it.

Just a few thoughts, but they all revolve around TOT. You do have it don't you?

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