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  • Why Nemoesque Graphics

    I've seen a lot of talk praising "Nemo-esque" graphics to high heaven. But could someone let me in on why they're so popular. I personally think they have a kind of fake and cartoonish look. Is there a virtue I'm missing? I'd really like to appreciate a lot more of what's available for this game, really.

  • #2
    Frankly, Patine, this is a touchy subject.
    In his time, Nemo was quite a pioneer (but definetly not the only one) in good scenarios with consistent style of units. He merits respect for loads of work.
    If you don't see this by yourself, nobody will be able to do it for you, imho. So what's the point?
    Ceteram Macedonicus
    (got the 'Macedonicus' part as a title for playtesting Bernd's Imperium Romanum)

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    • #3
      In a word, why not?

      If you can produce real high-res graphics with the limited amount of pixel space that CIV2 gives, I would love to see it.

      If the thread author is unhappy with the current graphics work being done by the civ community,
      I then respectfully invite him to provide us with a superior alternative.
      http://sleague.apolyton.net/index.php?title=Home
      http://totalfear.blogspot.com/

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      • #4
        Also, cartoonish though they MAY be, that makes them clearly identifiable, and nemo style has evolved into fairline, danny/curt
        Calling all Designers, the SL CivGroup is open for business!

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        • #5
          I concur, Nemo graphics work nicely with other parts of Civ2 such as the terrain and city screen. They may look cartoonish, but they also are incredibly accurate and detailed. Hi-Res graphics try to be realistic, but with the limited colors of Civ2 they seem blurry. Also, hi-res is usually not completely isometric which makes identifying the units harder and creates a a unit set without uniform units.

          And besides. Nemo units allow people like us to spend our free time to be artistic in a forum that appreciates such things.

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          • #6
            Yup!

            And I would mention that Mr Tuttle is also one of the creators who have evolved the Nemo style forward.

            Sadly, CIV2 has not got the game engine capabilities of CIV3.

            In such a 3D environment, incredible graphic marvels are possible.
            In the sprite-based world of CIV2, we use what techniques we have at hand.

            And it just so happens that the nemo style works best.

            That is not to say that the other types of graphics are not legitimate...

            That is where ToT's 24-bit units are useful!

            I urge patine to take a look at catfish's graphic workshop thread, before he writes off isometric units.
            http://sleague.apolyton.net/index.php?title=Home
            http://totalfear.blogspot.com/

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            • #7
              Yeah, he is good with vehicles, but the Civ2 engine also has an advantage in that it is easier to create graphics. I have managed to edit aprox 40 ships form only about 14 originals for my as of yet unnamed scenario, and if yu read my posts, you know I am an idiot and a noob.
              Calling all Designers, the SL CivGroup is open for business!

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              • #8
                To kind Curt, to kind. I am only an amateur. Many others out there, such as Fairline, Catfish, and yourself, are the ones who have kept Civ2 alive.

                Hi-res does have a place in Civ2, as such designers as Kobiyashi have shown. Also, there are many designers out there who do not use Nemo style specifically. Rather they use the 2d model style for their units creation, which is in and of itself very stylish and crisp. Colonies IV, which has become a favorite of mine, is not Nemo persay, but goes the route of pseudo hi-res, historically accurate units.

                Nemo style is a favorite of many creators because of the simple fact that it is easier to create units from scratch using that method. They look accurate, colorful, and can be easily distinguished.

                Quite frankly, for a scenario, I don't have a preference, as long as the designer has made the effort in creating an environment that suits the scenario.

                Overall, effort is appreciated in the realm of Civ2. Style points are best left up to the critics.

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                • #9
                  Patine:
                  You are not the only one
                  I also think that the nemo-style tanks and planes look cartoonish.

                  Of course, as Harry Tuttle said:
                  "Hi-Res graphics try to be realistic, but with the limited colors of Civ2 they seem blurry. Also, hi-res is usually not completely isometric which makes identifying the units harder and creates a a unit set without uniform units."

                  I suggest you to accept it, and deal with it, ok?
                  If you take a look at my scenarios, youŽll see a mixture of nemo-style and hi-res (photo-realistic)
                  You have to learn to appreciate the best of the two worlds

                  Believe me, there are excellent nemo-style units
                  In due course, youŽll also enjoy those graphics.


                  However, if you still want to take a look at the "other option", just contact me. i have plenty of "hi-res" modern units
                  South Atlantic Conflict v1.2 - Civ II Scenario
                  Iron Curtain v1.1 - Civ II Scenario

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                  • #10
                    My last word in this mini-debate:

                    There is room for all styles in the community.

                    I can salute Fairline or Kobiyashi (and everyone else)

                    For anyone who makes units graphics, be they Nemo-style or Hi-res, are doing the community a service.

                    Every new unit breathes some new life into CIV2...

                    Be happy, it's the new year!
                    http://sleague.apolyton.net/index.php?title=Home
                    http://totalfear.blogspot.com/

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                    • #11
                      I'm glad to see that we can discuss this topic peacefully, since this has been a very touchy subject earlier. I couldn't stand nemo-units myself until I saw the maginicent work of Fairline. He made the nemo units look marvellous!

                      My scenarios also has high-res units, or at least I consider them a fair compromise between nemo and high res. You'll find many of them in my sig.

                      Happy new year everybody! May 2004 be the year were civ2 has its golden age!
                      Find my civ2 scenarios here

                      Ave Europa, nostra vera Patria!

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                      • #12
                        The main point for me is, I often can't recognise Hi res graphics for what they are.
                        Calling all Designers, the SL CivGroup is open for business!

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by GoPostal
                          The main point for me is, I often can't recognise Hi res graphics for what they are.
                          I agree with this one, and another thing, they fit more into the rest of the graphic elements of the game (terrains etc).
                          "Peace cannot be kept by force.
                          It can only be achieved by understanding"

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                          • #14
                            Didn't we have this argument at Civ Fanatics some time ago? Despite my partisan involvement in that silly little tussle, I came to the conclusion that there are excellent units produced both in isometric form and scanned and photo-reduced. For the best examples of the latter, see the work of Hardjoy and Catfish, and Eivind has produced a nice hybrid of the two styles.

                            As with most things, it's a matter of personal taste. As Curt says, if you want to redress the 'Nemo' versus 'photo-realistic' unit imbalance, then feel free to have a go yourself. Catfish gives a good 'how-to' guide in the graphics workshop thread.

                            Happy New Year to all!
                            http://sleague.apolyton.net/index.ph...ory:Civ2_Units

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                            • #15
                              They may look cartoonish, but at least you can tell wether that's a tank or a bug you swotted against the screen.

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