Lorraine Cooperative Game Thread

[lord of the mark]

to recount, for someone who doesnt yet have EU, but likes Alt History.

POD 1419 - Lorraine which in OTL was a quiet fief of France, and had was briefly under Burgundy after 1473, etc, instead takes advantage of this stage of the hundred years war to take on Burgundy, and ends up swallowing Burgundy. It avoids, it manages to do what the Burgundians tried but failed to do, use the english alliance to dominate the area of France, at the expense of the descendants of Hugh Capet. Theyve also expanded into Germany.


Thoughts
1. in OTL, when English power receded with Jean D'arc, squabbling English under Henry VI, etc France recovered and Burgundy made peace with France, eventually going to the Hapsburgs. This doesnt happen here - why? I presume that Lorraine is big enough and clever enough (with a human player taking full advantage of EU rules) to be much stronger than Burgundy at the key moment.

Do events only happen to player country - ie if you play is Lorraine is there a Jeanne D'arc event in France?? English history events??

2. Historically this is a period of great power consolidation, important royal marriages (castile-Aragon, Burgundy-Hapsburg, England-Scotland, etc) Lorraine should be looking at this. With Lorraine an enemy of Hapsburg, Hapsburg should be looking for a marriage to counter and surround Lorraine. France, England, or Castille.

[Velociryx]

Hit the nail precisely on the head, LOTM! The essence of our opening gambit in Lorraine was to make use of the biggest and best ace we had.

We had no army to speak of, and were surrounded by powers larger and stronger than ourselves, but we DID have one advantage. GREAT diplomatic prowess.

Using this, we were able to first side with france against Burgundy, eat all but one province, then play the role of the turncoat, ally WITH England and Burgundy, and begin expanding at the expence of France.

That was the impetus for our growth, and there can be absolutely no doubt but that diplomacy has already won this game for us. Using it to first cozy up to France, and then betray them, we were able to flee from one strong alliance to another with lightning speed, and then use that alliance cover to our advantage...a safe garden to grow in. (and yep....France still gets the Jean D'Arc event, even if not played by a human! ).

We saw briefly in this game, where the Hapsburgs attempted to rein in our power, but they chose their allies poorly (well, it would not have truly mattered who their allies were at that point, as we had the only folks strong enough to save them firmly in our camp....Castile and England). Had England not been able to get Castile in bed with us, they almost certainly would have joined the Hapsburgs (or vice versa) which would have made for two more evenly matched alliance families in the region, and that would have reined in our growth, no doubt.

But with France ravaged, and Castile (now Spain) and England on our side, we simply dominated the stage.

And, there are signs that Austria is trying again. She now has an alliance with Hungary, Bohemia, and Croatia, and collectively, these guys are the number two alliance grouping in Europe. The Danes, with their fistful of Germanic allies are number three, but even if the Danes and the Austrians declared against us simultaneously at this point, we have, between the members of our alliance family, sufficient manpower and significant leadership to push them back.

France is still a minor factor, having allied themselves with a passel of minor players in Europe. Individually they're not much (Portugal, Eire, Auvergne, Savoy, and the Papal States), but taken together, and given their position relative to our borders (breaking them up as they are), they represent a larger-than-the norm threat, so we're not out of the woods yet.

The other thing we have working against us is me, sadly.

I have been a HUGE proponent of economic focus, and while it has served us well (I played a bit further, and we're now the #1 economy on the planet), our military is woefully behind the times (we have land tech 3, France has land tech 9). True, we have a big, imposing army, but pound for pound, we're a 98 pound weakling in the technology of the times. A problem that needs to be addressed before we get our butts handed to us by a force a quarter of our size....for the time being however, we're raking in the bucks, and putting it to good use.

-=Vel=-
PS: Burgundy still gets absorbed by the Hapsburgs, too! That event will prolly appear in our next segment!

[Velociryx]

Key Events in our Alt History Project

Because I'm "too close" to the project, as the one playing it, I'd like to see what events spring to mind for those of you participating here that have truly shaped us and gotten us where we are.

The two biggies that stand out, even for me, are:

* Our performance in the first war, against Burgundy

and

* England gaining Castile as an ally

But I'm sure there are loads of others! Thoughts?

-=Vel=-

[Velociryx]

'k...if there are no comments or thoughts on the next segment, I shall play it out then! Will have the results up here soon!

-=Vel=-

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Velociryx
'k...if there are no comments or thoughts on the next segment, I shall play it out then! Will have the results up here soon!

-=Vel=-

Go ahead, i'll be interested in seeing it.

[Velociryx]

Out with the old, in with the new....

1473 was a year filled with both sorrow and hope for us and for our People. It saw magnificent triumphs (over Austria again), and an occassional hair raising moment or two, but in August of that year, our beloved Duke dies, and his cousin, Rene II takes the helm of the Duchy of the rising star that is Lorraine....

[Velociryx]

And so, our trend and luck with monarchs gifted in the art of Diplomacy continues, for while Rene may be only an average military man and administrator, his greatest strength is that which has been Lorraine's greatest strength since our bold adventure began, and that is, Lorraine's leaders have a long and growing history of being extremely gifted diplomats, and in 1474, we begin once more utilizing that strength with letters to Burgundy (+93), England (+87) and Castile (+110)....letters sent to demonstrate a continued willingness on the part of Lorraine to maintain the status quo in our alliance despite the new change in leadership of our nation. This pleases our allies well enough, and mollifies any concerns they may have had about Lorraine going her own way.....

....the year passes quietly until December 2nd, of 1474, which stands as a watershed moment for Lorraine, and marked a clear turning point in her future.

On that date, the tiny Duchy of Navarra breaks free from English dominance, and when England calls for the allies to stand with her, none of them rally to that call.

Fearing what the destruction of this hugely successful alliance means, Lorraine too, opts not to answer the alliance call, and the alliance is shattered, but Rene II is quick to act, summoning the allies to his palace in Nancy where talks are immediately held regarding the future of the alliance and what it might mean to the long term security of the alliance members if we were to part company now, after such a stellar string of successes.

Rene's speech is powerful and compelling, and the alliance is re-forged with England, Castile, and Burgundy....but with a key difference.

No longer is Lorraine a participating member of the alliance family, but placed at the honored head OF the alliance family....a testament to our Duke's power of persuasion and diplomatic savvy. No longer is Lorraine relegated to the back seat of this alliance, but she is the Master!

And our good fortune continues!

In January, long-time enemy France forges an alliance with a belegured Navarra, Auvergne, His Holiness, the Pope, Portugal, and Erie, and in May of that same year, Castile declares a war against the Portugese! We happily comply with this unexpected turn of events, and see all the allies on both sides rally to battle!

[Velociryx]

Another War with France

Dear God, but we have lost count of how many times we have faced the wrath of France on the field of battle. Surely this time will be the war to end the mishandled dream of the early French Kings. Surely this time, we will be utterly and completely victorious.

And we take our time about it, too.

Carefully and methodically, we plan for the demise of our arch-enemy, France, marching the Zeeland Cav Command to Dauphine, the Lorraine Cav command to Lyonnais, Flandern Regement to Ile de France, the 20th Maine to Vendee, and Poutou's Regement to Guyenne.

Just to be sure, we also raise an additional 6,000 Infantry to serve as a ready reserve, and hire 5000/500 Mercenaries (a regement of English Pike) in Berri to bolster our troop presence in that area.

In July, the English take command of our siege in Guyenne, and we leave them to it, happy to have troops to spare for other duties, not the least of which is a siege of Provence, which we regard as MUCH more strategically important to us than Guyenne, as it will give Lorraine a port in the Med!

Alas, our forray into Provence does not go well, and our invading regements are forced to withdraw.

To bolster them, we hire a regement of Dutchmen, 8000/500 strong to assist in this ongoing struggle and make plans to re-invade Provence when morale has recovered sufficiently.

By December, we have all of France's continental territory locked down (well, England has Guyenne for us, but...it amounts to much the same thing), and the last remnants of the Army of France are marching to relieve their beloved Paris.....as we outnumber the approaching army by a comfortable margin, we feel certain they will not succeed, and in fact, they do not....

[Velociryx]

As our war with France grinds on into 1476, we face a 9k rebellion in newly won Baden, and our Wurtemburg Regement, which had been staying out of the war with France to guard against such rebellious shenanigans, moves swiftly and decisively to put it down. Duke Rene may not be a genius military man, but he is no fool, either, and knows only too well the danger of committing all available forces to any single cause....even one so tremendous as the defeat of our long time enemies.

This rebellion, and the ease with which it was handles, clearly demonstrates the wisdom of this approach.

So....as our war continues, it is very much a waiting game, and one by one, the lands of France come under our direct control.....Dauphene in July, Vendee in December, Ile de France in February of 1477, and then....

An increasingly desperate France offers us Vendee and Dauphine for peace, along with 92d!

Given the sorry state that Portugal is currently in against Castile, we dare not drag the war out any longer, lest we lose all our gains....so...not the decisive final victory we were hoping for, but further gains against once-mighty France as we accept this latest offered peace!

Immediately, we move to formally add these new territories to our growing Kingdom, incorporating them by appointing Tax Collectors with all speed.

The peasants of Berri, showing their support for the fading French cause, rise in rebellion, six thousand strong, but this rebellion is quickly put down, and a rebellious Gelre, breaking away from Dutch dominance is absorbed only four months later. We had hoped that rebellion would have succeeded, but alas....

In April, 1477, our THIRD refinery is begun in Baden, and in September, we raise war taxes as the Irish attack Zeeland by sea! We beat the invaders back, but this serves as a painful reminder that while we have made peace with the French, we ARE still at war with the other members of her alliance family.

November sees another blow, as a group of prominent Clergymen in our Duchy seek to bend the ear of the Duke, expressing their bitterness over the recent trends toward innovation in the realm. All these breweries and such popping up over the realm....and where would it end?! Or so they tried to argue, but the Duke (being rather busy with the ongoing war) would not hear them, and so they took to the streets of Nancy and beyond, preaching against the State and generally making a nuisance (stab drops to +1 as their demands are ignored).

As our war enters the year of our Lord 1478, we are beginning to feel the strain of such a protracted conflict. Nonetheless, we are faithful to our allies, cementing our ties by renewing Royal Marriages with both Castile (+200!), and England (+107).

In April of that year, Auvergne is captured, and we demand (and get!) Cevennes and 50d from that long time French lapdog. Another rival down!

As we are now well away from most of the direct fighting, we order the military to stand down, hoping to simply ride out the rest of the war quietly.

Sadly, this is a mistake, for mere months later, the Irish attack Zeeland from the sea again, this time with more than seven thousand cavalry.

As that battle rages on (a battle we are losing), we frantically offer Portugal 400d for peace, formally extricating Lorraine from the war and rescuing the Zeeland garrison, but our people are exhausted! (WE is -7!!!). It is time to rest and rebuild, and 400d was a small price indeed for the chance to do so, and for our three new territories!

Immediately following the war, there was a period of uncertainty as our nation breathed a tired sigh and got down to the business of rebuilding and re-structuring ourselves after this war.

Of course, there were disagreements on what form this restructuring should take, which led to a bit of infighting amongst some of our nobles (Noble Families Feud) - sadly, this "bit of in-fighting" quick escalated all out of hand, and before we knew it, there were more than twenty thousand men under arms in Champagne, forcing us to race to quell the rebellion.

It took the combined efforts of three of our Regements, but we did so, and then continued to sort ourselves out.

That process took until February, 1480, when (on St. Valentine's Day), our Duke took another step toward fully centralizing his government's power - prod effie to 28% (still two points of WE remaining).

[lord of the mark]

thanks, very entertaining.