Tactics for Medieval:Total War

[Jamski]

Does anyone here at 'poly play M:TW ? I just started playing this seriously as a break from SMAC waiting for MoO3 to come out, and I'm hooked. I find I do better letting the computer automatically resolve the battles, but that takes the fun out of the game. So - a call for help. I want to play the battles and I want to win without having to use overwhelming force always. I have discovered 2 important strats so far:

1.) There is never any reason to build peasants 27 Feudal Knights beat 900 of my peasants. Painful.
2.) Always take some light cavalry in an army and hold in reserve for chasing stragglers after the battle. Useful

That's it, so I need some help here. I never have enough money either.

-Jam

[Grumbold]

You're wise to avoid peasants there are virtually no circumstances under which they can beat anything. Charging downhill in a rainstorm against the rear of an archer unit maybe, as long as something was scaring them enough to stop them turning round to face you.

I tend to win by having a solid polearm backbone to my armies. Feudal Sergeants and up can deal with just about anything except horse archers. Find a defensive position and line them up. You can thin the ranks to spread out if you have to, but they work best in depth. A formation like = -- -- = -- -- = is good. Then have a couple of archer units very close behind to pepper the enemy and draw them onto your spears.

Hide Cavalry wedges behind your flanks only to wheel out and hit the enemy side and rear once they have committed to charging your spearmen (or your spears advance onto them). They are expensive and die easily so like you say, use them only for flank attacks and pursuits. Even pursuits become a luxury when you get 20+ units opposing you. Your cavalry will be exhausted before their fresh reinforcements appear if you are not careful.

For best effect you need to "trick" the Ai. Don't advance your spears onto specific enemy units. Set a target spot behind the enemy and advance toward that. If you target enemy units the AI will instantly react to you but there's usually a small delay (as their should be) if you just advance generally. This is about the only way a foot army can pin down and crush a light cavalry army. Slowly advance and spread out so that you can sieze any opportunity to close around a few units, crush them and then expand out into line formation again and repeat.

[Jamski]

So, line up all my spears and advance eh? I'll be giving that a try tonight. I assume I put everyone into a line, select all, instruct to hold position and then click somewhere behind the enemy lines of battle. Is that the general idea? I find that I also have a big problem with mounted archers. I can't ever seem to catch them. The AI has won a couple of defences through "time-out" as I chased their horses for 30mins.... argh! I suppose I need my own horse archers and more of them ?

Thanks for the tip, anyone else got a good one?

-Jam

[Kc7mxo]

Grumbolds got some good ideas, and I'm glad to hear you're playing Medieval. its a rocking game. The official forum is at http://pub24.ezboard.com/bshoguntotalwar , and shogun.org has some good strats. But they're a bunch of elitists.

There is a very good use for peasants, if you're cheap. Masses of peasnats with good generals can win just about any battle via the autocalc.

But thats not really any fun.

Myself I tend to tailor my forces to what I'm facing. One of my preffered methods of assaulting is similiar to Alexander's diagonal advance.

Form your solid defensive troops on one side, typically spears and other type troops. Next to them is the combat infantry, swordsmen, halberds and such. Next to them is the hard hitting cavalry.

Advance so that the spears are furthest back, with the combat infantry next, and the cavalry furthest forward. Any archers march even with the assault infantry, behind the cavalry. Try to line the cavalry to the side of their defensive line. The enemy will be limited in his ability to redploy due to your furthest back troops. If he swings to face your assault troops, you hit him in the flank. The purpose is to try and hold most of his army in place while your best troops fight a smaller proportion of his. Make sure to keep a cavalry unit or two in reserve to handle any extreme situations.

This strategy has worked for me, though it can be hard to pull off in certain situations.


And as to those dang horse archers, you do indeed some light cavalry of your own. But you can also out maneuver such retreating troops sometimes. The AI doesn't ussually rely on too large of groups of such troops. Unless you're facing mongols. And those battles are often so huge autocalc is the only way to avoid playing 12 hour battles.

[Jamski]

But I want to play 12 hour battles ! Actually I've only been playing M:TW a short while, and I just found the slider to hurry the time. Super JOY ! Now I don't have to wait for hours while my troops chase theirs off the battle field.

Thanks for the link.

-Jam

[Grumbold]

Originally posted by War of Art
So, line up all my spears and advance eh? I'll be giving that a try tonight. I assume I put everyone into a line, select all, instruct to hold position and then click somewhere behind the enemy lines of battle. Is that the general idea?

You got it.

I find that I also have a big problem with mounted archers. I can't ever seem to catch them. The AI has won a couple of defences through "time-out" as I chased their horses for 30mins.... argh! I suppose I need my own horse archers and more of them ?

With enemy horse archers the only answer is to spread wiiiiide. They can't charge the front of anything, so stretch out. Don't advance too far toward them, envelop them. Once you've covered the flanks, slowly close the noose. Eventually they'll try and break out in one direction. If you've done it right their only choice will be to rout off the map or into your troops.

[Kc7mxo]

But I want to play 12 hour battles ! Actually I've only been playing M:TW a short while, and I just found the slider to hurry the time. Super JOY ! Now I don't have to wait for hours while my troops chase theirs off the battle field.

Thanks for the link.

-Jam

Oh man. I don't think I could play that game without the slider. . . .You do know about the pause button right? Hit P to pause iffin you do not. Some people don't like to use it, but with 3000 troops on the field, its a lot easier to give orders.

[Jamski]

Yeah, but I always feel guilty pressing the pause button. I mean its meant to be RTS, not PTS (PauseTimeStrat) Having said that I completed Dune Emperor in one outing just by using the pause button. *yawn* Select all troops, move to back of enemy base, pause, select target, unpause, target instantly obliterated by firepower of whole army, pause again, select new target, etc. You can win without taking any return fire. Just always fire everything at the closest enemy, and hr can never get into range, aim and shoot, before... BANG ! So this game has really put me off using the pause button for ever.

Is there a use in M:TW for the gunpowder units ? 120 of these firing all at once killed one man, and before I could reload, they'd charged my "musketeers" or whatever they're called. Arbalesters or something. And then they died and ran. Do these units simply suck?

-Jam

[DrSpike]

I play this......and it's pretty good.

For strategy remember its essentially rock paper scissors, so you need to learn what is effective against what. With the latest patch cavalry got a nice boost, but with earlier versions spearman/pike units were too powerful, so bear that in mind.

Defending is easy. Park your ranged units on a high point.......and fire until arrows are exhausted. When they get in range retreat the archers and bring your spear/pike front line up, and keep your cavalry ready for charges against their ranged units. If you have arrows left you need to make sure you protect your ranged from his cavalry.

On attack you are basically attempting to make his lose formation by harassing with your ranged. Ultimately you will have to go for his lines.........try and break through with cavalry/shock troops and rout some of his units.

Hope that helps.

[Jamski]

Thanks Doc

One problem is that I'm not really sure what the best units are. The manual has no information or stats on the units, and the fold-out thing only says who can build what, and what buildings they need. I find the Byzantine Inf. chops up most things, but an army of 900 of these bad boys is a bit dull, if you know what I mean. There's a huge range of horsies and spear-sloggers, but are they really different ? Apart from the graphics of course.

-Jam

[DrSpike]

Yeah there are units within each class that are better. Check out the forums athttp://www.totalwar.org

[Jamski]

There's about a hundred pages of these things !

"Oh my God it's full of ... POSTS !"

I was kinda hoping you'd let something slip yourself, Doc but I guess not. I'll have to take a break from 'poly and get reading. I want to get the hand of M:TW before MoO3 or GalCiv come plopping on my doormat. Otherwise I never will.

-Jam

[DrSpike]

I would but its been a while and there are so many I don't remember all the names. I'm guessing saying, you know, the black ones, with the big spears isn't going to help that much.

[DrSpike]

Ok I fired her up (no I am not trying to put off starting work - how dare you).

Try these. A balanced army has around 4 spear, 4 sword, 4 ranged and 4 cav......though if you have bonuses for a certain unit you can change this a bit. Depending on your race try:

Heavy cav - chivalric knights
Light cav - alan mercenary
Defensive spears - order foot
Offensive spears - billmem
swords (both offensive and defensive by nature) - cmaa
archers - long bow.

[Jamski]

Thanks again Doc

Is it useful to have so many missile units? I find they're not doing more than 1 or two kills with each barrage, and certainly not stopping approaching units, or reducing them significantly. I must be doing something wrong. And what's the thing with the generals' characteristics ? Questions, questions...

-Jam