Microsoft to buy Bioware?

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by Asher

But the games Paradox and Illwinter make are just contrived, lame, and dull as what you get out of the megacorps -- just without the polish and marketing.

Honestly, I think it's a psychological thing for the people who are fans of their games. Boggles my mind.

[Jamski]

Don't laugh, you'll only encorage the trolls.

-Jam

[Imran Siddiqui]

Which will all be published first on the Xbox with a PC port in the works a year later. These "RPGs" will also probably be more like BG Dark Alliance.

KOTOR was published first on the XBox and was a very good RPG. Microsoft's own Fable looks to be an amazingly deep RPG as well.

But the games Paradox and Illwinter make are just contrived, lame, and dull as what you get out of the megacorps -- just without the polish and marketing.

[General Ludd]

Imran, are you seriously going to tell me that you think some of most original games made since the 90s are "lame, contrived, and dull"? Let's not even mention that Europa Universalis is widely considered to be one of the all-time best strategy games in most circles.


And don't tell me that the 'megacorps' always make polished games. Most games are released in just as dire a condition as Paradox games are, only they don't recieve the same sort of devotion through patches.

[Asher]

Red herrings abound!

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by Asher
Red herrings abound!

I don't think you know what that means.

[Asher]

1) No one said megacorps always make polished games
2) Of course the most original games aren't "lame, contrived, and dull" -- it just so happens that small indy studios aren't any better at this than megacorps.

In fact, I'm a big strategy game fan, and I think Europa Universalis is average at best.

And SuperPower is utter crap, though indy-idiots try to tell me otherwise.

Let's face it -- when you've got a crap budget with developers who couldn't cut it in the big leagues, you're rarely going to get a decent game.

People like you are the Snapcase of the gaming world. Unless it's underground or indy, it's mainstream crap and oh we can't have that...

[Dis]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

Which will all be published first on the Xbox with a PC port in the works a year later. These "RPGs" will also probably be more like BG Dark Alliance.

KOTOR was published first on the XBox and was a very good RPG. Microsoft's own Fable looks to be an amazingly deep RPG as well.

But the games Paradox and Illwinter make are just contrived, lame, and dull as what you get out of the megacorps -- just without the polish and marketing.

KOTOR was a pretty damn good RPG. I just wished it had been a little more "deep". They simplified a lot of the NWN combat and character system.

[duke o' york]

If MS buy Black Isle and Atari then does that mean that we can get some more BG games?

[DrSpike]

Originally posted by Dissident

KOTOR was a pretty damn good RPG. I just wished it had been a little more "deep". They simplified a lot of the NWN combat and character system.

I thought KOTOR had a more immersive plot than the NWN expansion I have played. Granted KOTOR would have benefitted from some of the more complex NWN rules, but the main thing I would have liked was to see the rolls. Often in KOTOR it was tricky for a new RPGer to work out what was going on under the hood.

[duke o' york]

Wasn't that the point of it though? It was/is an extremely playable game, but not exceptionally heavy in terms of RPG rules, so that both the Jamskis of this world, and RPG n00bs could both enjoy it. Hopefully it will have tempted some of these n00bs to find out more about the systems and some other, more hard-core RPG games out there.

[Kassiopeia]

[QUOTE] Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

Which will all be published first on the Xbox with a PC port in the works a year later. These "RPGs" will also probably be more like BG Dark Alliance.

KOTOR was published first on the XBox and was a very good RPG. Microsoft's own Fable looks to be an amazingly deep RPG as well.
/QUOTE]

Yes, KOTOR was a wonderful exception to the rule, it even got a decent PC port

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by Asher
1) No one said megacorps always make polished games

But it was implied. When you're saying that small-time developersmake less polished games, you're essentially saying that big-time developers regularily make a practice of it. They don't.

2) Of course the most original games aren't "lame, contrived, and dull"

Then don't run your mouth about Paradox.

And SuperPower is utter crap, though indy-idiots try to tell me otherwise.

I think you're making this up. I've never seen a single person say that Super Power is good, outside of maybe a fanboy or two in their own forums. At best, it had potential.

And what was that about "red herrings"? I don't think I mentioned Golem studios. I might aswell start talking about Activision's Valu-soft devision now.

Let's face it -- when you've got a crap budget with developers who couldn't cut it in the big leagues, you're rarely going to get a decent game.

Ratio wise, it seems that the small guys produce more quality games to ****-fests then the developers backed with big budgets and publishers do.

But my original point was that the small guys "who can't hack it" tend to care more about the game than the money - they're making the games they've always wanted to play. Developers like Paradox and Illwinter put their heart into it and continue to tweak and improve the game years after it's been released (and they even play their own games. ) They listen to feedback from their fans during the whole process. You don't get that kind of love from developers who're only interested in reaching the dead-line and starting on a new project.

People like you are the Snapcase of the gaming world. Unless it's underground or indy, it's mainstream crap and oh we can't have that...

[child of Thor]

I've been hearing this rumour for a little while now, ever since KOTR was being done.

We are going to see a world dominated by the few - i've been moaning about it for ages

this wouldn't be so bad but the kind of games these 'few' turn out are IMNSHO, 90% of the time a huge steaming pile of doo dah

The industry has pasted itself into a corner that it cant afford to get out of.

So it will be the smaller companies, working for their real fans that will continue to make the better games(Paradox for example).

When i see Atari/Infogames/EA/Activision(sorry - you did release the CTP2 source, but you still haven't been redeemed just yet) etc on the box - i run away to read a review first, or come here and see what people are saying

[Nostromo]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

Microsoft's own Fable looks to be an amazingly deep RPG as well.

I'm expecting a slightly deeper RPG than, say, Dark Alliance. But nothing like BG 2. Remember that Molyneux complained that BG 2 was too complex. I would be pleasantly surprised if it had the depth of a game like KOTOR. But I doubt it. I'm expecting something like Black and White: nice gimmicks, boring game.