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Plague! Disease! Pestilence!

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  • Plague! Disease! Pestilence!

    With regard to realism, I see no reason why gameplay can't mirror history... in effect at least.

    The problem with earlier civilization games is that they all fail to realize actual events which cause actual problems. In Civ and Civ2 both by Microprose, there aren't any plagues. In real life, however, the Bubonic Plague swept through Europe killing over 50 million people. Smallpox swept through the americas after being introduced by Cortez's men leaving only 10% of the population alive. Even as recently as WWI over a quarter of the world's people were infected by a pandemic of influenza. Malaria, AIDS, and a whole plethora of others buth new and ancient have been a boon of civilizations throughout history. This absolutely MUST be a factor in game design, especially in that it provides a totally new and different enemy for players to deal with. This would provide an ultimate solution to a host of problems. First, ICS would become suicide (by facilitating the rapid spread of infection). Also, military oriented civs would be caught offguard with an inability to deal with the new terrors.

    Here is a proposed plan just off the top of my head:

    Each map square will have a series of toggles, indicating a positive or negative variable. These could be as follows "Disease A:+, Disease B:-,Disease C:-" etc., whereas in gameplay "Disease A" might be named "Smallpox". Any undected diseases would have an X% chance of spreading to an adjacent square depending on infastructure, that chance would be reduced by half if that square is quarrentined the same turn it is detected and reduced by half again each turn after (after it's already too late, of course =). Cities connected with active trades routes would have a 99% chance of spreading the disease.
    Aqueducts will reduce the chance of an outbreak occuring on that square by 50%, but will facilitate a spread by doubling the chance if an outbreak does occur.
    Any infected units (unmarked during gameplay) automatically spread the disease to everything it touches. Imagine the terror in a player when he recieves the message "You Legion has been erradicated by the Plague" when that player realizes that same legion has been through the heart of his empire. Consequently, there needs to be a time lapse between infection and detection.

    This new concept would give great value to technology advances like "Penecilin" and "immunization," while providing some more aggresive players to pursue "Anthrax." And perhaps it will cause great striving towards wonders like CTP's Immunity Chip.

    The introduction of disease would provide a whole new dimmension of gameplay, way beyond a mere military threat. I believe it would thoroughly stimulate a new challenge to empirebuilders worldwide, and provide an alternative way for the computer to eliminate the weak.

    Please consider this.
    He's spreading funk throughout the nations
    And for you he will play
    Electronic Super-Soul vibrations
    He's come to save the day
    - Lenny Kravitz

  • #2
    Guildmaster:

    Please don't ask us just to consider this - I have said all good ideas will be implemented, if they are possible. This one is a very good idea, and it will most certainly be in the game somehow. Diseases are the key element in world's history. Also that would make it possible to add realistic biological weapons to the game.

    Especially well the system can be modeled with the population system I have proposed - each tile has populations, and the excact amount of people in them is told.

    Another thing is the "ordinary" diseases (ie. that don't cause pandemias) like malaria. Depending on the technical level of the infrastructure, each square has a "disease level" that will kill part of the population in the square.

    There has to be also ways to fight the diseases. In medieval times, the only way to slow down the spreading of the pandemia was quarantines, I think. In modern times, there will be more.

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    • #3
      This idea is great!

      Another thing could be that some civs could be immune (or almost immune) to a disease, while other civs that has not yet been in contact with it can have very little resistance to it and so be seriously hurt by the disease.

      We will need to develop a disease model that is both complex enough to be realistic, but also simple enough to not be using too much gaming time.

      I do not have any revolutionary ideas on this now, but if i think of some I will certaintly post them here.

      And I think Amjayee said it right. We will not, like Firaxis just take ideas into consideration with a low chance of them being in the game, but actually incorporate as many as possible in the game.
      "It is not enough to be alive. Sunshine, freedom and a little flower you have got to have."
      - Hans Christian Andersen

      GGS Website

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      • #4
        There has to b diseases, some that are very powerful (Ebola), capable of wiping out entire civilizations if unchecked, and some diseases that are mild (common cold) and only affect production and revenue a little bit.

        How about this...
        Each sickness has stats, just like military units would have attack, defense and stealth variables.
        Infectiousness: 1-10 with 1 being E-coli which doesn't spread on it's own and 10 being Influenza which is airborn. This is the rate at which the disease is spread and generally modifies the quarentine variable.
        Incubation: 1-10 1 being several years and 10 being just a few days. 1 diseases would spread throughout the whole population before any notice is given to the player and would take a while before the effects take shape while 10 diseases can wipe out whole squares before getting a chance to spread.
        Mortality: 1-10 with 1 meaning only a few physically weak people might die and 10 meaning a 100% mortality rate, no survivors. (not necessarily everyone gets sick, of course)
        Cureability: 1-10 with 1 being a simple parasite that can be washed off, 2 is a parasite that requires some special treatment, 3 is a bacteria that can be treated with herbs, 10 is a retro-virus for which there is no cure at present. Certain advances can adjust this number- the discovery of penicillin etc. With new strains, the higher number here indicates resistance to earlier treatments.

        Of course these numbers can change, after x number of turns treating "disease c5" with penicillin, it's curability number wiould be raised by 1 in a new strain and renamed "disease c6"

        HIV- Inf 3 Inc 1 Mor 10 Cur 10
        Influenza- Inf 10 Inc 6 Mor 1-4(var) Cur 9
        Smallpox- Inf 7 Inc 5 Mor 9 Cur 6

        etc. these are only a few possibilities. Based on a civilizations medical knowledge index the chance of detecting increases, mortality rate decreases and the number you get for being able to cure a disease increases.
        He's spreading funk throughout the nations
        And for you he will play
        Electronic Super-Soul vibrations
        He's come to save the day
        - Lenny Kravitz

        Comment


        • #5
          Guildmaster:

          Now that sounds great. I'm sorry I can't comment better right now, since I'm working on the web design site, and meanwhile coding like crazy the map prototype. Both of those you will hear about more in just a few days.

          But generally, your suggestion sounded like a very good system.

          Comment


          • #6
            I still like those ideas.

            With that system, it would be possible to model the diseases, that tend not to spread very much, like malaria, and the pandemic diseases, like influenza. Also some diseases might require certain kind of environment. Malaria spawns only in wet areas, like swamps and jungle, and cannot spread to more dry areas very effectively, for instance.

            Also the population density and the amount of connections between countries affect the spreading ability of pandemic diseases - black plague would have killed much less people, unless trade hasn't been so active in the Europe, and if the continent wouldn't have been so over-populated at the time. The modern-day influenza couldn't have spread as fast in the medieval times, etc.

            The diseases wouldn't be needed to show on the map or anything. You just have a certain array of dirrerent kinds of diseases, that exist in certain area, and kill certain amount of people there, depending on the "abilities" of the disease, and the health-care system of that region. Every once in a while, some highly-infectious diseases will cause epidemias or pandemias.

            Diseases would be generated randomly in some tile, according to the conditions in that tile. The disease could be named after some real-world disease resembling that disease, or it as a combination of appropriate words... then it would spread to other tiles, if conditions are good.

            Each disease would have a certain "activity" level in each tile. So, starting a military campaign in an area infected by some disease might become very costly...

            Diseases would be fought, and it might be possible to entirely kill a disease, when medicine is developed sufficiently high, like has happened with small pox, and what is being done with AIDS.

            Diseases should definitely be added, with the system proposed by Guildmaster - perhaps a little refined. Great ideas!

            Comment

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