4th Apolyton CtP2 SP Tournament: 3 September - 3 November 2002

[Shadow]

Haven't played for a bit... still struggling at around 200AD...

[Jesper Portus]

Damn!

I lost the "dance"!

My three enemies kicked me out of the game.
It´s no good to kill one nation and have three war with the rest. After a while they are really strong!

So I restart (my first in all the tournaments - tribut to craddle!) and this time I will not so peacefull!

What I mean?
At the start I marsh to the greek and conquer them - as my first game.
But I also marsh to south and battle the green - and I won!
After that with 6 cities I built only armies and fightb again the brown - and I won again!

Thanks hexagonian for your advice: Battle the AI before they became strong.

Now I´am at 12 cities, City State Government and at war with persian and egyptian. (Reason: Bloodbath). With my power I hope to stand this fight, but I´am in the defence. In 2.000 BC the AI-nations are military to strong for my warriors and spearmen.

I havo only one problem with this mod: By entering a hut I will must sometimes wait up to 5 minutes until the game continues. Only when I found soldiers or tech - so it´s a pleasure to wait.

I have a lot of fun with this game!
Hope you to!

So long
Jesper Portus

[Jesper Portus]

Originally posted by Jesper Portus
Damn!

I lost the "dance"!

My three enemies kicked me out of the game.
It´s no good to kill one nation and have three war with the rest. After a while they are really strong!

What they did?
I lose 7 of my 8 cities. Only a small outpost is left.
I have one big stack with warriors and spearmen - but they are destroyed by the attack on rome ...

The end of a great nation -

But the rise of a greater roman empirre!

Yeah!
I will kick the AI!

Jesper Portus

[Maquiladora]

Sad to hear I take it your scores wont be official if you restart the game. I had some really close moments too, just never give up! The AI always has at least some of its cities really badly defended, its just attacking the right ones. Once you start taking its cities, theyll disband all those stacks near your cities because they cant support them, attack is the best form of defence. Barbarian cities are always nice to see too, means you dont have to go at war with a friend to take it.

[Jesper Portus]

Originally posted by Maquiladora
1) Sad to hear I take it your scores wont be official if you restart the game.
2) I had some really close moments too, just never give up!
3) Attack is the best form of defence.

1) I hope not! It´s LOCUTUS decision.
2) I never give up to, but with one city an 12 old units - no chance. It was an simultan attack bei the green, brown and purple. I´ve mad the mistage to built no armies after the victory over the orange. Only built city improvements and wonders. This is my normal tactic, but in this mod it´s no good.
3) I learned it: In this Mod: Yes!!!

Jesper Portus

[Maquiladora]

Try and move those 12 units deep into an enemies borders, and choose a city that you think is weakly guarded. Preferably a big city. You never know! I got 5 Etruscan cities like that.

Same as me with the city improvements, i managed to get the Ziggurat in about 5 of my biggest cities after taking out the Etruscans (green), then the Greeks(orange) started knocking at my door again straight after. I also got the Temple of Solomon but it was obsolete about 15 turns after building it

[Dread_Doomfist]

Originally posted by Maquiladora
Sad to hear I take it your scores wont be official if you restart the game.

what? if i restart the score wont be official? why that? i thought you can't send in more than one save-game...thats one of the primary rules...and in the tournaments is nothing to read like "don't restart the game!" if you say "don't restart"...you must say "don't load a autosave-game or a save game before your last one where you go to bed or so...but it's not possible if the game crash...and it's not possible to control..

it's ok to send in only one save-game...but don't restart?...restart can improve your tactics...learn from your mistakes..and you will be better...and you understand the game better...and it's more enjoyable...

DD

[Maquiladora]

To restart youll also know where all the enemies are going to come from and prepare for their attacks at the right place. I thought you could only submit one game for the official ranking, but that was under the rule you played through the game the first time. You can submit as many games as you want, only one official. If it crashes its fine to restart, but you have an advantage over the rest if you keep restarting until you get it perfect.

[centrifuge]

I personally don't agree with restarting the game from the beginning, except in the case of a computer crash or something similar, but definitelty not because the AI is kicking your butt

This is a tournament, we are comparing skills, and learning from each others games. IMHO restarting takes away from the experience, because you already know where the AI's are located and this gives an unfair advantage, taking away from the surprise, as well as much of the "strategize as you go" aspect that should be present.

Anyway, Locutus has stated during previous tournaments, that the intention is that we not restart. However, there is no way to tell if a player does restart or not, so therefore we are all simply on the honor system.

[Dread_Doomfist]

hmm..an unfair advantage?...then you most stop all communications in the forums about the game, showing screenshots and many more.(it could include details of the game..and not less, if you're clever enough and understand to read between the lines).....or if the first one sending in his save-game, look at it and you know also the details..and you can play fast in the last days the game......

if i had know this..i had not writing in this forum and tell details of my game...and where are the AI is...sorry about this..but i'm not the only one...

and let me say this...it's not really an unfair advantage..after start and playing few turns..the greeks stay with a unit in front of one of your towns..they explore very quick..and at this time..you can ask for to go out of your territory..after this..you can ask for a map and the greeks will give you this map...in my opinion...ok..its an advantage to know where the AI is..but a so little one...and how many of you use the hints in this forum...and going strictly to the AI to kill they fast? how many?

i respect the system of honor....and i hate it to cheat or playing unfair...but please..update the rules and say it directly.."don't restart if the AI kicks you"...for new members...

ok..my actuall game is the third one..and in tribut of honor i will not post it for the official score...only for the unofficial one...

regards..

DD

[centrifuge]

DD, I don't have any problem with you submitting your game for the official score, I know that you are certainly not the only person that as ever restarted this game. Locutus, however, has the final decision I suppose.

Anyhow, ladies and gentlemen I guess that I'll be the first to submit a saved game. As I said earlier, I went for the quick win... and it's was a pretty darn quick one, the quickest I've ever had anyway

I had fun, but reading through this thread, I feel as though I missed out on a lot. A non-stop struggle for survival, while going for a conquest victory, just seems to hold more merit than a quick diplo win, IMHO. But who knows what next time will bring.

Diplomatic win 3700 BC,
just hit the end turn button

[Dread_Doomfist]

hexagonia:

and it seems another bug..maybe critical...i can't finish the game...or..it's impossible to finish the game with science-win...

if i have research gaia-controller..in the last turn before it has finished..the game hangs up....no reaction....
can't do anything....so its only possible to win the game with diplomacy or maybe endyear...and bloodlust is in this tournament off..

DD

[mnbryan37]

Centrifuge,

Congratulations!! I have never played for a diplomatic victory, but I am amazed you could finish any form of this game that early. You must be a great dipolmat.

Jesper,

In a game this difficult, I have no problem with anyone starting over if they get wiped out. Sounds like most of us came close to that. Yes, you would have information that would help you in the second try, but no 2 playings of the game are identical, so you might even end up with a more difficult battle.

I have not learned anything in this thread during a game that helped me score better. Hexzagonian's hints would be very valuable in the next game I play, but I was too far along to change my overall strategy in the current one. I think downloading someones completed game would be helpfull, but I assume most of us don't do that until after we have also submitted.

[Locutus]

The restart issue is a tough one. One the one hand it's not fair to the people who play the game once that some others restart 3 times and thus gain a huge advantage (you know what the map looks like, what's in the goody huts, which AIs to avoid, which ones to attack, etc), and the same goes for this thread: those who read all the spoilers on this thread before starting to play have an advantage over those who play early on in the month and post these things in the first place. On the other hand, if people are not allowed to restart, there would in some months only be 2 or 3 savegames submitted (see Tournament 2), that can't possibly be in anyone's interest either. And the spoilers in this thread, the sharing of experiences and the discussion of tactics, are exactly what this Tournament feature is about and what makes it so fun. On top of that, if I would make 'no restarts' an official rule, a lot of people would simply cease to post on this thread to update us all about their game and would play the game possibly over and over again until it's perfect and would only use this thread to submit their final savegame. In that case we can only guess about how many restarts people may or may not have done. Right now, although restarters have an advantage, at least we have a reasonable idea of who restarted and how often (and can consider this when comparing skills).

I don't want to have official rules on this (because they can't be enforced) but the an unofficial rule of thumb would be that you don't restart unless you've actually lost the game. Once you've seen that defeat movie, you're allowed to restart. Restarting just because you lost a battle or the AI conquered one of your key cities shouldn't be reason enough for a restart, but if you've actually lost the game, it's not in anyone's interest if you would not be allowed to submit a game for that month...

centrifuge,
3700BC Amazing... you are either EXTREMELY good or EXTREMELY lucky...

[Locutus]

Originally posted by Dread_Doomfist
and it seems another bug..maybe critical...i can't finish the game...or..it's impossible to finish the game with science-win...

if i have research gaia-controller..in the last turn before it has finished..the game hangs up....no reaction....
can't do anything....so its only possible to win the game with diplomacy or maybe endyear...and bloodlust is in this tournament off..

I've had this problem i other mods as well, with both Science and Diplomacy victory (and once even with Bloodlust). The game can be awfully stubborn when it comes to letting you win (the AI must be holding grudges ). Try disabling all extra options for that final turn: movies, trade routes, unit movement, etc. Try a lower screen resolution, close background apps, etc. If you can't get it to work, send the savegame to me and I'll see if I can manage it - sometimes the problem is PC-specific (last month I couldn't finish TheArsenal's Diplo victory while he himself and one other person had no problem with the game).