The reason for the CTP2 forum's revival?

[Hermann the Lombard]

Originally posted by Assur
Man, I wish I could play CTP2 right now... Civ3 is still unplayable, Civ2 is ok though it's quickly getting boring. Why did I borrow my CTP2 cd to someone who I haven't seen for a year now

Well...I just walked into Software Etc. in Brooklyn on Sunday, and picked up a new copy of CTP2 for $20.

Mind you, I disagree about Civ3. I'm enjoying it a lot, but then I avoid multiplayer like the plague (I'm in a nearly-terminal time sink already...and I play as slow as a snail). At heart, I'm also not a modder (that's my day job), though I did enjoy HiRes for Civ2.

However, I do agree that Civ3 probably won't have the long-term replayability of Civ2, in part because many of the challenges of the last couple of years in Civ2 are already known, and already solved in Civ3 (OCC, for example).

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Assur


Well, I've only seen it in one store and it costed $38, which is more than most new games

You could check around on some of the online retailers; I'm sure you could do much better then $38. Alternatively you could ask ZigZag where he picked it up for $6.00!

[August Borms]

Originally posted by Oerdin

You could check around on some of the online retailers; I'm sure you could do much better then $38.

I'm working on it

I already checked the Belgian online shops but nothing (at a decent price)

If they don't have it in Antwerp I might have to go to Brussels (yuck) and probably get a French (yuck) version.

Anybody know if there are translations available for the game texts like Civ2 ?

Alternatively you could ask ZigZag where he picked it up for $6.00!

I'd do that if I lived on the same continent as ZigZag

[August Borms]

Originally posted by Hermann the Lombard

Mind you, I disagree about Civ3. I'm enjoying it a lot, but then I avoid multiplayer like the plague (I'm in a nearly-terminal time sink already...and I play as slow as a snail). At heart, I'm also not a modder (that's my day job), though I did enjoy HiRes for Civ2.

However, I do agree that Civ3 probably won't have the long-term replayability of Civ2, in part because many of the challenges of the last couple of years in Civ2 are already known, and already solved in Civ3 (OCC, for example).

For me it's mainly the lack of a scenario editor why I don't like Civ3. I played the standard Civ2 game only 5 times or so, and then I started playing scenarios., 4 years long the same scenario's from Conflicts in Civilization and Walnut Creek's Toolkit for Civilization over and over again

Civ 3: finished 2 games, then got bored with it

[Leonidas]

Assur:

You may be pleasantly surprised with CTP2 I know I am.

1) The game is very inexpensive right now

2) It comes with a huge tech/unit/terrain poster (remember those!)

3) Nice opening movie and Wonder movies

4) 12 gov'ts

5) No more worker clickfests

6) You can form military units into armies (12 unit max) and units can be added or removed whenever you want. I love this feature - it's so easy to do

7) By adding either the Apolyton Pack or Cradle mod, several game issues have been fixed and the AI has been made to be more aggressive.

Frankly, I'm having a lot of fun with this game.

If people have been frustrated with Civ3 but don't want to go back to Civ2, check out this game. Here is a game that is worth making scenarios for

[Locutus]

Originally posted by Leonidas
You may be pleasantly surprised with CTP2 I know I am.

That's great to hear, Leonidas I never expected to see vets like you and Lancer (spotted him in the CtP1 forums) to give this game another chance (and liking it too)!

If people have been frustrated with Civ3 but don't want to go back to Civ2, check out this game. Here is a game that is worth making scenarios for

Now, that's something the people in the Civ3 Forums should hear Coming from you, it might even convince more people to give this game another chance

[Leonidas]

Locutus:

Thanks for the kind words

But all the praise should be directed to you, the modders, and several people on Activision's development team who obviously had a vision for this game.

Activision really dropped the ball on this game by abandoning it. After being modded, it is a very interesting game to play. I have mentioned the game several times on the Civ 3 forums, especially on topics dealing with stacked movement and worker click-fest tedium. . .

I love the army concept: it has been smoothly implemented in this game. Frankly, it just makes sense in a game as huge and time-encompassing as a civ game.

Anyway, all you guys keep up the great work. In the mean time, I've got to get back to my game. The wascally Germans are up to no good

[Peter Triggs]

several people on Activision's development team who obviously had a vision for this game.

You took the words right out of my mouth. Three guys (that I know of) have to be mentioned. The guy who put together the original algorithm was Dr. Ian Lane Davis. He's now head of his own company:

Mad Doc Software was founded in November of 1999 by Dr. Ian Lane Davis, formerly Technical Director at Activision's Santa Monica studio. At Activision, Dr. Davis put his doctorate from Carnegie Mellon University's School of Computer Science to good use as Lead Programmer on Dark Reign, AI programmer on Battlezone and Civilization: Call To Power, and Lead Programmer, Technical Director, and co-Project Lead on Star TrekTM: Armada

Carnegie Mellon might not be a well known university, but it must be very good for Computer Science. All I know about it is that Dana Scott, one of the world's most eminant living mathematicians, left his post as Professor of Logic at Oxford to become Professor of Computor Science there.

Another bloke who has to get some credit somewhere is Richard Myers. He did the AI and I don't know anything about him: he seems to be a bit private. But last year, after Activision dropped support for the game, he came on these forums and gave us helpful advice on how the AI works.

But, IMO, the guy who has incredible vision is Joe Rumsey. In the context of Civilization games, SLIC really is the best thing since sliced bread.

[Locutus]

Hear, hear, Peter! I agree with every single word.

The other person that should be mentioned is of course Winnie Lee, aka St Swithin, the first and only professional female software developer I've ever known (but I sure hope more will follow or my professional career is gonna be a really boring one ). She wrote some of the most 'interesting' SLIC code and wrote the first and only 'celebrity-column' here on Apolyton Not sure how big her impact on CtP2 was but she was one of the 'senior staff members' and present on these forums a lot, helping us out wherever possible.

Originally posted by Peter Triggs
SLIC really is the best thing since sliced bread.

After all, it's called SLICed bread for a reason

[Dinner]

This post is for Assur and anyone else who is looking to giving the modded CTP2 game a second chance. I found CTP2 on Amazon for $19.95 plus you can specify which language you want it to come in. I'm sure you could find it even cheaper then this if you dug around a little.

[Primarch]

Hi!

Well I'm one of those who played CIV III and was really disappointed by it. Even after all the mods I've used for it and patches it lacks a certain something I can't quite place my finger on.

There were many things about CTP that I liked and thought CIV III could have learned something from those games, but I guess not. NOw I'm into CTPII with the mods and the game is most fun!

Primarch

[Dinner]

Yes, I think the spill over affect from Civ3 has really helped the CTP2 revivial. Now the question becomes how do we keep it going? I'd like to suggest we begin a MP player registry and have an official Apolyton CTP2 tournament. Not only would it be loads of fun but activities like this would be a good way to interest new people and to expose them to some of the mod-communities last efforts.

[Locutus]

Oerdin,
I agree, we must organise all sorts of activities to keep things going. Many of us are posting in the Civ3 and Community forums whenever the opportunity arises to promote the game and get even more people here. Back in the old (UBB) days we used to have regular polls, with my 'age poll' I hope to have made a start in reintroducing that tradition. Your multiplayer registry is a great idea as well, that's why I immediately offered to top it (or rather have it topped); just get 3 or 4 people to post their data and I will do so. An official MP tournament would be absolutely fantastic as well, I'll gladly do anything I can to help out with that (except participate, I *really* don't have time for that). I'm seriously considering to 'host' a succession game myself - I don't really have time for that either but if it can bring that tradition back to live again I think I'm willing to make the sacrifice (it's less time consuming than MP games).

Other activities by other people are very much desired and appreciated as well. If anyone needs additional promotion in the form of news items or topped threads, I'm more than willing to abuse my power position with the mods to help out.

[August Borms]

Oerdin, thanks for the info but fortunately I found it in a shop for just a a few $ more than at Amazon.

Leonidas, I knew all that (that's why I was so disappointed in CTP2: it has such great features, but the weak AI made it unplayable) except that I never played the mods.

Now I'm about to start my first cradle game

[Immortal Wombat]

Good luck