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**Swissy** · May 21, 2002, 07:34

Couple of old-timers you may not remember are Tal and Ming. Tal was a master at land battles and could hold his own against any in island wars. I would say that Ming probably was one of the first to discover the various tricks and uses them effectively. Ming was mainly a land players. Ming had health problems and would be off for weeks to months at a time.

Tal- 2-4 years ago
Ming 2-4 years ago (off and on)

**Gavrushka** · May 21, 2002, 08:33

Troll.... I don't measure up against some of the players on that list - My defeat by Yoda was humiliating - he was as far ahead of me on PG as I would expect to be against a Newbie- BUT it has opened a LOAD of new questions for me... The all time greatest can ONLY be establised by a VARIETY of game styles- CTP is not one game it is many - A Land game is a style, a pure Island games is a style... A ruin free pre-made map is a style, a combination of Islands and Land is a style.

There are players that play categories of CTP well... But I guess you are asking something a bit deeper than that.... The only player I know plays VERY well on all styles is Blackice... But I think he will admit he may not be the master of every kind of CTP - From what I understand Paul and Yoda are the two best current players... Although Catete after a long absence Plays exceptionally well under many game types - I think it would be great if people like Paul and Yoda would play a greater variety of opponents as it is the only way we can learn.... I am also going to say something I NEVER thought I would.....

..... Rush buy switching is perhaps something that could have its merits.... And it was very clearly explained to me why - On random maps we can have varying start positions.... IF you are forced to work with low prod high growth land it can take 20+ turns to get a settler out.... Your opponent may have a forest river - If that is the case you have lost the game before it starts- BUT switching could equalise a game under these conditions - Player with high growth land is STILL disadvantaged by having to purchase , and having low prod land - BUT at least he can keep up with Settler production... I kind of feel if switching was kept to granaries settlers and within say first 30 turns - It is meritable... Wow, did I really say that.....

**jpww** · May 21, 2002, 09:38

Oh no you didn't!

**Gavrushka** · May 21, 2002, 10:07

I did I DID!! - It goes against everything I ever believed in but do you understand my reasoning??

**TheBirdMan** · May 21, 2002, 11:19

Yes I did understand you.

No, I do not want to play this way. A bad starting position is ALSO part of the game.

Ask Paul, if he liked his starting position in Monkey 1. Ask me if I liked my in Lung DM 3.2.

Both answers would be NO I think. But that's the game.

**Flandrien** · May 21, 2002, 11:29

I still remember playing gigantic pbem in 2001, featuring Pin firmly in the lead as the Romans.
I thought I was doing quite well in that game. (Especially because Pin was fighting Stavros and leaving me in peace.

)
Too bad the game died without a real ending.

**Gavrushka** · May 21, 2002, 11:51

I was not suggesting in PBEM Bird, I appreciate that diplomacy and totally different gameplay styles mean there is no need in PBEM - I mean in MP - where it is two players in a mad race to dvelop civ for conquest - nothing else involved, no diplomacy, no alien life victory Just war...

**Grandpa Troll** · May 21, 2002, 14:14

Originally posted by Swissy
Couple of old-timers you may not remember are Tal and Ming. Tal was a master at land battles and could hold his own against any in island wars. I would say that Ming probably was one of the first to discover the various tricks and uses them effectively. Ming was mainly a land players. Ming had health problems and would be off for weeks to months at a time.

Tal- 2-4 years ago
Ming 2-4 years ago (off and on)

Yeah, forget them too!

I got whooped terribly by Tal!

Gav. I agree, some have advantages over others, depending on game styles!

I remember a pretty good player, Minh, he said he was handicapped, but still pretty good player!

Troll

**faded glory** · May 21, 2002, 15:18

Tito used to beat me and pin in a 2 on 1. He was the best..He is someone who has 20,000 production and be light years ahead in tech on turn 100. No offense to gav, but he was better than you. This was 2-3 years ago.

**jpww** · May 21, 2002, 19:15

Tito must've been cheating

Gav,

Rush-buy switching will benefit you and your opponent as well

I agree with Birdman's last remarks.

**Gavrushka** · May 21, 2002, 19:47

Well I just played Yoda again - last game I played no switching.... this game I played with switching- last game he had 6 times my PG- this time we are equal.... I dunno.... I think it should be a choice - the argument i put forward is it BENEFITS the player in the weaker production position more.... i.e. it equalises start positions...

**Grandpa Troll** · May 21, 2002, 20:12

Originally posted by Gavrushka
Well I just played Yoda again - last game I played no switching.... this game I played with switching- last game he had 6 times my PG- this time we are equal.... I dunno.... I think it should be a choice - the argument i put forward is it BENEFITS the player in the weaker production position more.... i.e. it equalises start positions...

As I have faithfully tried to play this game "SANS-SWITCHEROO or Rush-Buy thingey I still dont know exactley what it is a person does I just have read or monitored threads explaining that for an advantage in cost one can switch something in build quere and come out WAY ahead..~sigh~

Maybe I will find out what it is that people do???

Oh well, but at any rate, if all people understand and accept, i see no problems, but some have used it on me as well as others and well, it dont seem right is all

**Lung** · May 21, 2002, 20:12

Re: Who are some of the Best All-Time CTP'ers?

Originally posted by Troll

F

G is pretty good, thats Faded Glory for those whom dont know him

Faded Glory??

I was gonna say that he's a has been until i realised that he never was

**Grandpa Troll** · May 21, 2002, 20:48

Re: Re: Who are some of the Best All-Time CTP'ers?

Originally posted by Lung

Faded Glory??

I was gonna say that he's a has been until i realised that he never was

Look Lung, you gonna break his wittle heart, stop please, shes kinda fragile, U know what i mean?

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Who are some of the Best All-Time CTP'ers?

Who are some of the Best All-Time CTP'ers?

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