Turn 32, 2760BC

[notyoueither]

... or they have another scout out there

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by dejon
Eye of the Storm (Size 3) WF (2,4,8)
Growth: 3/26 (6 turns)
Production: Skirmisher (4 turns)

I'm sorry, but this was a mistake.

We're soon going to have a mined sheep (5 tile). We just slowed ourselves down to work a 3 tile.

We need to take our minds off turns to skirms and put them on turns to growth.

[notyoueither]

Bottom line. Get to 4 pop ASAP.

The 3rd fp is a 5 tile. The 4th pop on the sheep is a 5 tile. That's the way to max our possibilities.

And it's a close call on the sheep every turn. The sooner we get to 5, the sooner we can work a second mine. There's a trade off in there somewhere, but there is no trade off on the way to 4. Max food!

[Blake]

nye, working the grassland forest is fine, next turn working 2 floodplains and the sheep will complete the skirmisher with no overflow - it was nessecary to get that 25th hammer either this turn or next turn (no difference which) by working a GL forest.

Otherwise I agree that we should probably max food until size 4, then go to sheep + 3x floodplains.... that leaves us with a +4 surplus, which is tolerable.

[notyoueither]

Why do we want no overflow? Is this Civ3?

[notyoueither]

What I'm concerned about is that we are finding 52 flavours to slow ourselves down. After this next 2 turns, there'll be a call to stay on the mined sheep for some other build.

We're choking ourselves.

[Hot Mustard]

Originally posted by notyoueither
What I'm concerned about is that we are finding 52 flavours to slow ourselves down. After this next 2 turns, there'll be a call to stay on the mined sheep for some other build.

We're choking ourselves.

I agree. Turn-by-turn planning is no longer enough. I have been glad to see some longer range detail planning in the 'After the 1st Skirm' thread. How should we formalize longer term plans? Create turn threads 10 turns out? Create and maintain a single long-term planning thread? How has GS managed this in the past?

[vmxa1]

Does anyone know when the research on Philo will decay and at what rate?

[Velociryx]

re: long rang plans, IMO, one of the best favors we could do for ourselves is plan by objective.

At present, we're in a war with Vox. If the majority of the team is all for smashing them into teentsy weentsy bits (and it seems we're more-or-less in favor of this), then we should plan around a core set of objectives to make that happen, regardless of how many turns.

For example, we have already identified these as being pivotal to our plans:

* Establishing a choke in Voxian territory (no firm estimates yet on what the force structure should look like, so this should be discussed in detail...for the moment, let us call our choke force

3 Skirmishers
1 Warrior (already on scene)

with reinforcements as needed

* Gaining an unbeatable production edge.

Two items under this category:
---> Reach size five in the capitol with all speed

---> Establish a second city (post copper)

* Intel

Two items under this category:
---> Continued scouting northward (if not with a scout, then our next best option would be our Woody II warrior) - needs to start immediately, if not sooner, and CAN begin immediately, if we use the Woody II guy.

---> Complete research on BW and locate all sources of copper in the vicinity

* Assault Methodology

Serious discussion needs to occur about exactly how and when and with what force we'll assault Vox to bring them down. Much of this discussion hinges on the copper situation, and when we get a second city, as it would take an unbearably long time, even with our capitol at size five, to defeat Vox with only one city....so we really can't do much here until we get the underpinnings in place, but part of these discussions would be a call for peace and a plan to await the arrival of catapults to bury them (as mentioned previously by Dom)

Others?

-=Vel=-

[Randolph]

Vel,
Ok, that makes sense, maybe I was getting ahead of myself. We should really make a detailed projection of comparative forces in the field, including a theoretical vox production schedule and travel times. I’d like to do it, but unfortunately I actually have to work today at work .
Quickly on shaky assumptions. This is just to get the ball rolling (and for my personal amusement ), then a solid prediction.

Assumptions
(1) they started building archers last turn [v. likely one of the two techs they just got is archer; but they could be trying to complete a worker]
(2) they will continue building archers non-stop [v. dead-ender, it’s likely they will try to get a worker in]
(3) they are maxing production [this will mean no commerce from tiles]
(3)(a) squares worked = 3 grassland forests and 1 plains cow = 6 production = archer in 5 turns (6/25).
(3)(b) +1 fpt
(4) Distance to vox = 10 turns [depends were we want to get]
(5) our production = skirms in 3 [average including the almost finished one]
Predictions:
(6) we will have 3 skirms in place in 19 turns
(7) in that time vox would have 4 archers [in one turn]
(8) it will take them an additional 10 turns to have 2:1 odds [not including warriors, probably fair to say they cancel; this break-out-ratio probably fails at larger numbers]
(9) this gives us 20 turns of choke; for every additional skirm we build (3 turns) it will choke them for an additional 10 turns.

The tactics of what goes on in the field is obviously more complex then a ratio, but I figure we should be able to severely impair their growth up to 2:1 odds.

Edit:
If this is at all correct, then 3 skirmishers will probably gives us enough of a window to found a second city, hopefully next to copper if it’s not in EotS’ radius, while keeping them in roughly the same economic position they are currently in.

Edit2:
I’m starting to see the vox situation in three phases, any of which could be the end given the right opportunity:
(1) Build skirmishers to choke them long enough to found a second city and connect copper.
(2) Build axes to regain the field (if it was lost), and choke them while we continue to grow and research construction (catapults).
(3) Finish the job with catapults.

The other option is obviously cooperation, but personally I don’t see this working long-term, and it will cost us just as much in lost opportunity to conquer them later. Not to mention inefficiency caused by lack of trust, communication difficulties, and mismanagement.

[Ennet]

Originally posted by vmxa1
Does anyone know when the research on Philo will decay and at what rate?

only builds decay, not research..