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Horde-Sarantium War: Worst Cases

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  • Horde-Sarantium War: Worst Cases

    So, we're about to fulfill simultaneous contracts against the Horde and Sarantium. It should be our finest hour as money-grubbing Mercs. But it also seems to have a lot of potential for backfiring on us. I figured it would be worth discussing the possibilities of where things on our continent go from here. (What is our continent's name, anyway? I suppose that until the end of the forum blackout, there was never really a need to differentiate our part of the world from the rest...)

    So, here are two big problems I can see occuring. Both would have one root cause: our blatant playing both sides causing the Horde and Sarantium to wake up and realize that we are not, and never will be, on their side; and that, if they can actually trust each other, they'd actually find a better guarantee of an ally in each other than in us.

    Now, this isn't likely. Due to events in the C3CDG, there's bad blood between a lot of ex-Babylon players now on Sarantium and a lot of ex-Horde players now on the C4DG Horde. It's not at all surprising they've ended up at war (even though their settlements are almost comically far about from each other for the time being - it would make more sense to me for us and Sarantium to be at war). And if we were any other team, I imagine Sarantium and the Horde would simply be at each other's throats by default, with the team in our position sitting pretty deciding the victor based on who they choose to ally with. Indeed, this is pretty much what's happened so far. But we're about to show them that we are not going to do the "smart" thing for a civ aimed at "winning": we aren't going to choose sides. And that creates a whole different ballgame. One in which, if we are left undisturbed to serve both sides, neither Horde nor Sarantium can feel all that secure. Yes, there is the upside for both of them in that both can feel secure we won't be committing ourselves to the other side, either, and that might be what keeps this situation from degenerating for us. But we should at least consider what happens if it does not.

    A Challenge to the Merc Way of Life
    Sarantium and the Horde are probably going to express outrage when they realize we're running simultaneous contracts. Thing is, neither will be in a situation to do much about it: if they attack non-hired targets or do anything to piss us off, we can break off our deal with them and lose them military forces that are fairly vital to them. So they can't do anything proactive.

    What I think they could do, if they got together and compared notes, is to simultaneously call off their contracts with us. Boycott us, basically. This wouldn't actually do much to us in game, we could just withdraw; but it could hurt us when this came out on the public forum.

    Challenges to Merc Survival
    This is the worst case scenario where they really unite, and decide that there can be room for both of them if they take us out. This is bad. Really bad. I'm worried about this situation, but I'm not really certain what we can do to prevent this, except trying not to anger anyone unnecessarily.

    If this does happen, there are plenty of things we can do defensively to dig in, but to actually get ourselves out of this situation I think we'd have to violate our own precepts - after all, the reason this would happen is our inability to commit to anyone's side. :/ So if this happens, I foresee a long Merc defense without much opportunity for actual Mercing.

  • #2
    I have given this long thought. Months of thought. Years? (when did we find out who our neighbors were?)

    Let me say this.

    No matter what happens in the future. We set out to bring a new dynamic to a demo game. A team selling units, remaining perfectly neutral in all circumstances. We have accomplished this with flying colors. No matter what happens, we hold our heads high declaring that we set out and did EXACTLY as we said we would.

    The Public Forum

    Team Sarantium is more likely to go after us out there. And they will make every attempt to claim we're violating our concept and/or our contracts by the simultaneous contracts against 2 opposing teams.

    Our response:

    We have upheld every contract with Team Sarantium. We have attempted to get Sarantium to understand our neutrality. All they had to do to avoid our contracting against them was renew their open borders with us. At no time in the 20 turns of it's existance did they seek an extension.

    Alternatively, they could have hired more units, ensuring we did not have forces to use against them. No, they saw opportunity to skirt the settlement agreement by taking Horde cities for themselves. Cities they would not be allowed to settle themselves, while hiring the minimal amount from Team Merc deemed neccessary for the job.

    Team Horde. Here is a team that tested the neutrality of Team Merc. I deny any other team to claim they would return to neutral standing with a team that razed their city. We had every right to wish them gone. Their actions left us no one to bargain with other than Team Sarantium. They should not be surprised we had contracts with them. Yet, we maintained our neutrality, and once fair payment was agreed upon, we returned and made contracts with them.

    Both teams are in this situation via their own actions, and not by a consequence of Mercenary involvement.

    Team Sarantium openly told us they don't like being next to us and wanted an ally. Attempting to convince us to leave our Mercy ways.

    Team Horde implied they want to help us win the game.

    Such arguments fall on deaf ears, as should be perfectly apparant by now. Mercenaries remain neutral. Period. End of story. Now, pay us or face our wrath.

    Merc Survival

    We are in a better position than you might think.

    Sarantium owes us 156 gold. And have agreed to share Mathematics. Refusal to pay will constitute a violation of contract, and is subject to the Mercenary defense clause.

    Team Horde owes us HBR (we might not get it before the contract, I'll try, but the timing is 1 turn off...) and a settler, and Sailing. Again, refusal to pay is subject to the Mercenary Defense clause.

    The only way these teams can join together and tie our hands at the same time is to pay off their depts first.

    Should that happen, we can cripple Sarantium by poprushing theaters on the border, and settling along as close to it as possible.

    The Horde, we still have no defined border with. We can easily out rex them into a corner. They attack? Defense clause.

    We outproduce both of them and outgrow both of them combined. We can turn food into science with specialists to out tech them as well. Especially as Philosophical.

    The Horde is a non-issue in this discussion. They've played themselves out of the running IMO. Sure, they have stuff to hire us with, and a large standing army at present, but that's about it.

    Sarantium...well, we'll just have to outplay them.

    Merc philosophy

    Yes, we're going to be a 2 civ continent eventually. (Unless they both go to war with us, then it'll be a 1 civ continent and we have to convince the others we're not bidding to win. )

    We do not, however, choose a side. Sit back, sale units. The one who buys the most the quickest will be the one who survives.
    One who has a surplus of the unorthodox shall attain surpassing victories. - Sun Pin
    You're wierd. - Krill

    An UnOrthOdOx Hobby

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    • #3
      Just had a thought while reading your posts. Great stuff by the way! Why are we waiting for the Horde to give us HBR? What prevents them from giving it to us now?

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      • #4
        Their troops are not in position yet.

        That's their call at the moment.
        One who has a surplus of the unorthodox shall attain surpassing victories. - Sun Pin
        You're wierd. - Krill

        An UnOrthOdOx Hobby

        Comment


        • #5
          Ah ok, sorry I'm not quite up-to-date about who owes what to whom and for what reason. Hadn't registered that the troop contract was being paid for with HBR.

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          • #6
            That's what I'm here for.

            They owe us HBR on start, Settler on completion. In return for the settler, we agreed to allow them to extend the contract with the survivors up to that cumulative cost if needed.

            4 axe, 2 spear, 4 chariot = 155 gold rental/10 turn. Essentially they can extend twice for a total of 30 turns. (not factoring in losses there, but they could ask for reinforcements too I suppose.)

            They didn't really mess around with that contract, they're putting everything they have into hurting Sarantium.

            They owe us Sailing for foxtrot. They're working on it.

            Maybe we need a thread just for who owes what where.
            One who has a surplus of the unorthodox shall attain surpassing victories. - Sun Pin
            You're wierd. - Krill

            An UnOrthOdOx Hobby

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by UnOrthOdOx

              Maybe we need a thread just for who owes what where.
              That sounds like a plan!! Otherwise I'll just keep hijacking threads with my silly questions on the subject!

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              • #8
                Well, I sent that letter we've been working on to the Horde. But given what Beta was saying, I'm beginning to think things are probably over already. Unless I underestimate the strength of the Horde-Sarantium rift, I'm guessing they're going to ally and find the extra breathing room for the continent in our lands.

                Best to wait for official confirmation, of course. And given that Beta talked at all, I'm guessing it may actually be honest if they decide to stick to our deals - not an attempt at betrayal. But I'm not optimistic they will stick to them.

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                • #9
                  Looks like I'm wrong. Sarantium sticks to their contract according to their latest message.

                  This is good for us. Decent for Sarantium. Possibly very very bad for the Horde if they stick to the principles Plato was using and back out of business with us.

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