Crossroads? - The Horse Situation

[inamirrordarkly]

I think it should be more clear that if they fail to comply with the ultimatium then it shall be considered that THEY have declared war on US.

[polarnomad]

Ok, so here's a not so polite version:

Sarantium,

Until this moment we have enjoyed an amicable relationship that holds much promise for the future. How you proceed will define the outlook of our co-habitation on this continent.

The lands west of the river, on the banks of which now stands your uninvited settler, are to be considered by you as Mercenary territory. The Landsknecht warns you that any step further west will be considered as an act of war against our people, and will be responded to expeditiously.

Withdraw your settler, and respond to our border proposals. The choice is yours, neighbor.

Mercenary Leadership

[Kloreep]

I'd suggest this edited version, tending slightly more polite and making it clear we want the horses:

Team Sarantium,

Until this moment we have enjoyed an amicable relationship that holds much promise for the future. How you proceed will define the outlook of our co-habitation on this continent.

The lands west of the river banks on which your uninvited settler now stands are considered Mercenary territory, particularly the horses that the Horde has already tried to seize from us. The Landsknecht warns you that any step further west by your settler will be considered as an act of war against our people, and will be responded to expeditiously, as will the building of any city placed to have these horses within its "fat cross."

Withdraw your settler, and we can work out a border in a more peaceful manner. The choice is yours, neighbor.

Team Mercenary

[Kloreep]

So, it appears to be all 4 posters so far in consent on the basic plan? OctX and inamirrordarkly, you both seem to support delivering an ultimatum of war, given that you're contributing to the message. So I think we have a fairly good-sized majority in favor of the war ultimatum...

I suggest waiting another 6 or so hours to catch the american evening crowd who may not have checked in yet, then playing & sending the ultimatum, unless there are major objections to the ultimatum plan before then.

[UnOrthOdOx]

I strongly disagree with changing our philosophy with reguards to declaring war over a border.

Thus, while it goes against my personal view on borders...:

The Horse tile was once in Merc territory. Thus entering it or absorbing it without permission is the grounds for war.

And frankly, the continent splits much easier N/S than it does E/W...

[UnOrthOdOx]

Ooo just had a thought...give me 20 min.

[UnOrthOdOx]

Never mind.

Well, game won't show it. I know the tile holds some culture, don't know for how long or the decay rate but the game won't show it till/if they settle.

[UnOrthOdOx]

One non-violent thought. We can settle as close as possible and obtain the ponies through culture. They won't be able to produce culture for some time yet, and certainly not 2/turn until they get both religion AND a temple. Settling 2 of the lake down there would steal the horses and gems, making their city worthless.

We can hit that site (or similar) in 11 turns by building the settler normally, considerably quicker (6-7 turns depending on actual site) with a switch to slavery this turn and popping it next turn.

This breaks no deals, allows us to get the techs still, and we can pop some theaters later to really cement our borders and drive home our point. What we would need to watch out for is ensuring we got Libs up ASAP there.

[UnOrthOdOx]

Originally posted by Kloreep
I'd suggest this edited version, tending slightly more polite and making it clear we want the horses:

Team Sarantium,

Until this moment we have enjoyed an amicable relationship that holds much promise for the future. How you proceed will define the outlook of our co-habitation on this continent.

The lands west of the river banks on which your uninvited settler now stands are considered Mercenary territory, particularly the horses that the Horde has already tried to seize from us. The Landsknecht warns you that any step further west by your settler will be considered as an act of war against our people, and will be responded to expeditiously, as will the building of any city placed to have these horses within its "fat cross."

Withdraw your settler, and we can work out a border in a more peaceful manner. The choice is yours, neighbor.

Team Mercenary

I think you've seen me pissed like this before Kloreep...seems to stir up my writing juices...

Anyhow.

/me cracks his knuckles and sits down at the keyboard.

Dear Sarantium,

From our first meeting, Team Mercenary has strived for a mutually profitable relationship with Team Sarantium.

From your first cries of distress we have strived to find some means of assisting you with your problems while maintaining our neutral stance.

From this first attempted agreement, where we offered to scout for you sources of copper, we have found ourselves in a position of awaiting your response, and only receiving said response after it is deemed to be at the most profitable to Team Sarantium, and the most detrimental to Team Mercenary. Through either wasted turns by our scout, or this recent affront to our border.

We have made every effort to open negotiations with you on the matter of a border agreement. And, we have been met with silence. This seems to be modus operandi for Team Sarantium for now we see your silence has not been mere sloth or laziness as has been proffessed, but rather a calculated attempt to plant a city prior to negotiating borders. A silence that speaks far louder than anything you could say that you know perfectly well this land is rightfully the property of Team Mercenary, otherwise you would have simply opened negotiations over it.

Since you have ingored our attempts at open dialog, allow us to now be perfectly clear. Team Mercenary was first to settle in the area with the founding of Foxtrot. We claim first right to the area of it's fat cross as Mercenary Territory. Team Mercenary has paid for this land in blood, and will not stand for it's defilement by the hands of invaders, nor by the hands of greedy onlookers. Any further encroachment by your settler will be seen as an act of war. Any settling in a manner which would include these tiles in the fat cross of a Sarantium city without prior written approval will be seen as an act of war.

Withdraw your settler and begin border negotiations in good faith that we may build a proper business relationship. Silence and deceipt do not business partners make.

[Kloreep]

Originally posted by UnOrthOdOx
One non-violent thought. We can settle as close as possible and obtain the ponies through culture. They won't be able to produce culture for some time yet, and certainly not 2/turn until they get both religion AND a temple. Settling 2 of the lake down there would steal the horses and gems, making their city worthless.

We can hit that site (or similar) in 11 turns by building the settler normally, considerably quicker (6-7 turns depending on actual site) with a switch to slavery this turn and popping it next turn.

This breaks no deals, allows us to get the techs still, and we can pop some theaters later to really cement our borders and drive home our point. What we would need to watch out for is ensuring we got Libs up ASAP there.

With a limit of 2 tiles between cities, they can ensure the borders by moving 4 before settling. Even settling where they are, the horses are right next to their city as opposed to a tile away from ours. A culture war would be quite difficult once they got some buildings up. Long-term, our horse supply would be simply quite unreliable.

[Kloreep]

Re: UnO's draft, Heh, a little stronger than I might go for, but sendable. I suppose we might as well include a little verbal venom if we're threatening violence.

[Kloreep]

I'm heading off. I'll play this tomorrow U.S. time, unless someone beats me to it. I think UnO's message is the best personally, and suggest we send that when playing the turn.