AC diplo discussion thread

[Daddy-O]

That's how I took it at first, especially with the L O N G delay, but then manic replied.

I think that if we do not hear a positive reply we should continue on in peace but not offer another deal like this.

[Addled Platypus]

agreed

[Daddy-O]

from AC:

Subject:Behold a second messenger

Greetings honored Banana Diplomat,

Again I apologise for the tardiness of our response, your women may remove their peels and ritually smoke them in celebration. The high court of the One Yang has been dysfunctional as of late. A new courtier to the imperial throne by the name of Tassadar has brought a new delicacy know as SPAM and it has become quite popular.

Your ABCS is appealing but we request a modification to address a concern of ours. We agree to have all technologies "on the board" for exchange but desired to exchange technologies on an equal cost basis. Thanks to the wise financial policies of our beloved Chairman our kingdom has a strong rate of scholarly inquiry which we expect will continue to improve in the future. Thus we feel that if the situation was agreed upon in its original form we would be excepting a too open ended agreement which might over time become unequal. If this trading principle is agreeable to your wise men then we will consider it agreed upon and can plan our first exchange.

Our tech plan is still unchanged consisting of Metals and Naval strategy with a shoot at an Early Colossus. If team Banana will research Writing and Alphabet then we could perform an exchange with somewhat along these lines. Were currently researching Iron working which is 11 turn from completion, we can again share any Iron sites we find in your territory as their is a scout headed their now.

meditation 114
priesthood 85
writing 171
alphabet 429
===============
fishing 57
sailing 143
iron working 286
hunting 57
masonry 114
pottery 114

The discovery of another team is most surprising, our scholars had assumed vast oceans surrounded the whole of our mutual land, beyond which one would sail off the edge of the world and be devoured by the great Python which holds up the World. If the Banana court would host a meeting between diplomats of this 3rd tribe our selves we would be quite grate full. We would in turn reciprocate by hosting meetings between your envoys and any tribes we might discover when we take to the seas. Tell us what dose one think of these newly meet peoples who come in Peace? Should we perhaps seek to form a league among us three should they prove worthy?

Untill our next meeting, may the way of the Banana of and way of Yang be compatable

Signed Impaler[WrG]
Diplomatic servent of the One Yang

P.S. I am resending this message as aparently theirs a problem with the first, oddly I can see my message in the sent list as the third in our most resent set of back and forth replies, hopefully this should get through to you, sorry for the inconvenience.

[Daddy-O]

I sent a message:

Impaler[WrG],
This is great news and your Yang is great indeed!

Concerning the ABCS, it is apEEling. Isn't it? I know that my people had hoped for a straight up free exchange of technologies. I will take your offer to my people and see what they say. I am sure that our tribes will come to an agreement soon.

Concerning the new tribe, they seem peaceful enough. We have only just met them. I might have slipped up telling you of their existence. A wandering nomad who calls himself snoopy369 has clarified some rules on inter-tribe communications. It seems that for us to discuss this tribe anymore would require us to send you pictures of them, possibly drawn on banana skins, and mediate in discussions until you meet them first hand. I will see what I can do to get all three nations communicating.

Concerning the Python, that's a scarey thought!

Concerning your messenger, since he has carried this communication to you, you can see that he is healthy and fully recovered.

Watch for our reply to your ABCS counteroffer soon. Until then, peace to you.

Viva la banana!
-The Diplomatic Banana

33

[Daddy-O]

OK. I have some questions:

1)What does this mean?

meditation 114
priesthood 85
writing 171
alphabet 429
===============
fishing 57
sailing 143
iron working 286
hunting 57
masonry 114
pottery 114

Are those numbers the going rate in gold? Turns 'til discovery?

2) I think the agreement needs an exit clause, even if it is just a date so that the two parties can break this at some point without going to war over it. Something like, "At the discovery and exchange of Fission this treaty is terminated." Or, "At the dawning of the Middle Ages this treaty is to be re-newed, or re-negotiated. If not done by the end of the third Mid-Age turn, the treaty is terminated."

3) I do not want to enter into a long term treaty to agree to exchange techs at a to be determined rate later. That is no agreement at all. I need someone on Team Banana to assign a value (gold?) that we are willing to buy and sell at to the techs so I can negotiate. Having the ability to freely give and take techs was one of the apeals of the original plan.

4)Are we in general agreement with this version of the plan? I know that we wanted a free exchange of techs but this close. I think we should figure out the outstanding issues listed above, sign something, and make an in-game trade to seal the deal. I'd like a game long ally. This could be the beginning.

What are your ideas? Did I miss something?

[Addled Platypus]

I would guess turns til discovery

Exit stratgey- hmmmm
at the least re-negotiate at each age

will give this more thought once I am back

[EPW]

There's no way those are turns until discovery

[Wise Ass]

Originally posted by Daddy-O
OK. I have some questions:

1)What does this mean?

meditation 114
priesthood 85
writing 171
alphabet 429
===============
fishing 57
sailing 143
iron working 286
hunting 57
masonry 114
pottery 114

Are those numbers the going rate in gold? Turns 'til discovery?

I think that is the "tech cost" or "research cost" of each tech, and if that is true, they need to bring more to the table. As it stands, if you add it up (and someone might want to check my math, I did it the old fashioned way) our cost is 899 and thiers is 771.

However, I would bite the bullet on the first exchange. The whole reason for the free tech exchange is so someone doesn't feel as if they are getting exploited after so long. However, I understand their concern of thinking they might get exploited after so long if they gain a scientific advantage.

My response would go something like as follows...

To our wise friend Yang and his most faithful followers,

We understand your concern with the possibility of there being an exploitation of one nation over the other if there was too great of a scientific advantage gained. In the interest of a long-well intended friendship, we would not want exploitation to come between us.

Therefore, we propose putting a "gold value" on tech research. The number we have been kicking around the Banana Orchard has been 1 Kilo of Gold for every 10 research points.

Based on your previous proposal, there would be 128 point difference, currently in your favor. In the nature of friendship, in this and all future deals, we propose that the number should always be rounded down. So that would take you to 120 research point difference, equalling 12 Kilos of Gold.

However, as with research time of Alphabet, you will probably tip the scale such, that we will probably be owing you Gold instead. In which case, we would use the same standard of measurement.

Also, I think it is important that we continue to coordinate our research into the future so we can be trading techs that are worth both our while.

Last, on the tech trade agreement, I should think it important that we discuss a term in length or scope. While we whole heartedly hope that this agreement would last through all of histoy, we understand that circumstances can vary. Thus, in order for us to remain on terms throughout this tech agreement, I think it important for us to renegotiate our strategy and possibly the gold conversion every time we enter a new "Age"

As for our new found friends, we do hope that we can add them to our alliance one day, however, as previously mentioned, it is far to early to tell. We shall let time dictate our relationship with them, just as we did with you, and we can only hope that it developes as well.

We send you the best wishes from our Wisemen and our leader whose name we dare not utter.

Viva la Banana,
~whoever

[Daddy-O]

This is what I am looking for. I will wait until tomorrow and send something close to what WiseAss has suggested if there are no objections.

concerning "kilos of gold". Is that a Civ4 term? Does 1 kilo of gold = 1g or 1000g?

[Wise Ass]

I just made it up, it is supposed to equal one CivIV gold unit.

[fed1943]

Yes, peace and tech trade.

We need it.

Best regards,

[Daddy-O]

Can you offer peace in-game to AC while I send an email asking to formalize our peaceful friendship?

I want peace as something seperate from the ABCS tech agreement. There is no need to tie our peaceful co-existance to a disagreement over Writing and 10 gold.

[Wise Ass]

Peace is a defualt stance as it has always been, we already have an ingame peace.

[Daddy-O]

Thank you.

[fed1943]

Current techs researched do not allow any negotiation in game.

Best regards,