Peace Dividend - Winning Sufficient Power

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by W4r_Machine
Did you sue for peace or you waited for them to sue for peace?
In my games if I'm taking on the superpower I'll take two cities at a time and sue for peace. Works like a charm.

I've tried to talk to him every turn but so far he refuses to see my envoy. Never mind, I'll just have to deprive him of more cities until he's had enough. I attacked him this time though, whereas the previous 3-4 wars he'd started, and he eventually sued for peace each time after I'd chewed up enough of his knights & swords.

(Since he wrecked my peace game I decided I wanted to beat tech out of him to catch up.)

[phunny_pharmer]

Score question- do you get any benefit from having a size 1 city or a size 28 city?

If so, are two size 1 cities (w/o culture) equal to one size 2 city?

I think I read somewhere that pop does not affect (it may have been in one of the threads here) but I can't find it. I also don't see anything on the score page.

Perhaps the score should take into account your economy and production potential. After all, part of a civ's power comes from its economy.

(n.b. economy should be a function of shields, trade, and percent corruption across an empire)

Would certainly help the investment in the Peace Dividend...

[W4r_Machine]

Originally posted by Cort Haus


I've tried to talk to him every turn but so far he refuses to see my envoy. Never mind, I'll just have to deprive him of more cities until he's had enough. I attacked him this time though, whereas the previous 3-4 wars he'd started, and he eventually sued for peace each time after I'd chewed up enough of his knights & swords.

(Since he wrecked my peace game I decided I wanted to beat tech out of him to catch up.)

"Peace can only be achieve through war"-some GUY

Anywho, I usually play the Germans, Japan, China, or Egypt. The Germans only shows up on my Egypt games or German games, so I never have to deal with him too much. Maybe Bismark is a war freak...who knows.

On my curent games the Indians wouln't talk to me cause I've reduce them to 3 cities from their original 14 cities. I started the war, I take 3 cities make peace and continue the war 3 or 5 turns later or when my guys are all healed up and crushed the resistance.

[Txurce]

I just finished CivFanatics' current GOTM, which gives you Egypt on a large archipelago map, against only five other civs, at Emperor level. Most players went for domination, given the probable extended solo research rate. Because I couldn't bear to build a FP in a totally corrupt city, I chose to stay small - just over 20 cities - and go for a space-race win. I got it in 1690, despite having to trade for just about every strategic resource (that's what isolationism gets you).

But what was most interesting about the game is that I played a virtually unblemished builder game. My first war was concluded with not a shot fired. My second came about from a dire need for coal, with only one source visible. I plopped seven riflemen and a settler on the coal tile, built a city, and braced myself for a counterattack. But the Germans ignored me, raiding my homeland instead, and my total losses were ONE (GA-seeking) War Chariot. That was it for the entire game - I neither took nor lost any cities, and barely skirmished. If I had bothered to expand just a little more, I wouldn't even have needed to take the Germans' coal. So I wouldn't be too concerned about playing a builder game on Emperor, except in the hypothetical crowded game that Aeson cited. (By the way, this game is a blast, as Catt noted elsewhere.)

[Cort Haus]

Txurce,

Loved your coal-raid against the Germans and the builder game you describe on Emp sounds encouraging - but did you start on your own island?

So for I've never had a whole island to myself on a standard map. I'd love to try some early peace and quiet, despite the research implications. There might be a distance_from_other_civs setting in the editor which by default means the human will probably have nearby neighbours.

Another question, Txurce - did you enjoy the luxury trading advantage of a small civ?

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by W4r_Machine
"Peace can only be achieve through war"-some GUY

..... Maybe Bismark is a war freak...who knows.

I thought it was something like "Win peace by preparing for war" (deterrent) rather than "Peace only thru war" (wipe out all opposition). Well, take your pick!

Anyway, Bismark is a war-freak because he and Shaka are the only ones with an aggrssion level in the editor of 5. Even Montezuma's only 4.

[Txurce]

Cort,

I started on my own island, as did Japan. The other four civs split two other islands, and there were other large uninhabited islands available. I had an island to myself as the Aztecs in one of my first games, but I think it's much more likely if you play archipelago. In this game, it would have been possible to avoid war with a neighbor, since there was so much room to expand (six civs, large world). You should try the game - it's still posted over there.

Yes, I did enjoy the luxury-trading advantage of a small civ, if by that you mean did I not get royally ripped off in trades. However, the deals got worse as I became more powerful, even though my size was near-constant after 500 AD (4th out of 6)... even with Japan, for example, who was growing faster than me throughout the game.

Here is my last trade, made to obtain the tech that put me in space two turns later:

[Cort Haus]

Wow, 15,000G + nook-power - what a trade! A lot of players would go to war next turn to stop those gpt's.

As you found, maybe it's not just pop size that makes deals lop-sided it's power as well. I'd love to know what the formula is.

[Cort Haus]

AI's can enjoy the dividend too

It was one of those large pangea maps that came out as three continents.

9 civs including me on the main landmass, and when we'd found the others as we entered the Industrial era, China had erased India, occupied the whole continent and were in the early Middle Ages.

The 12th civ, Babylon was alone on a continent, and stuck back in the middle of the Ancient Era.

All the other Civs on my continent weakened each other with constant warfare, which China kept getting involved in too, but the Babs sat there safely, peacefully and quietly clawing their way back into the game, until they eventually became a 'player' on the diplomacy screen. Soon they were my 'broker' (the one who effectively sells your tech to the others for you, by scooping up all available gpt revenue for itself to afford full-whack for new tech), and finally my only rival for the spaceship. I think they'd got four parts when I launched, with the rest of the pack nowhere.

So hats off to Hammy & the Babs, who on that occasion recovered from an era-and-a-half behind to come second.