The Virtues of being Industrious....

[Matt_G]

Originally posted by Theseus
Also, commercial may be a lot better post-1.29f... jury's still out.

There was someone at CFC who was hosting an SG I was following. They were playing a Commercial civ and were in the mid AD's when the patch was released.
When the game was patched with 1.29f, he said their gpt went up by 6 or 7 hundred! Can't remember what size map or how many cities they had.
So it does seem to be quite a bit better than it was.

[King of Rasslin]

Commercial is = to having a free courthouse in every city, I think. 25% reduction in optimal city number. It really is an excellent trait now.

India is really an awesome civ. My second best game was with India, but it wasn't as great as my Chinese warmongering. For peaceful players, India is a really, really good civ.

[Anglophile]

So I got rid of Commercial just in time for it to become useful. Oh well, I would still have to say Industrious is stronger and a better fit for my preferred playing style. Maybe I'll take Commercial back - it is at least a reasonable fit with Expansionist in that it is safe to pop all those goody huts - and give all the AIs four traits. Actually, that may not be a bad idea for another, not quite on topic, reason. I played the LWC mod by Plutarch for a long time and enjoyed it more than vanilla Civ 3. The AI on the higher levels with three traits were very tough indeed, building large empires and fielding even larger armies. A fifty or sixty city AI Civ in the late middle ages is a worthy foe indeed. After 1.29, I moved to the DyP mod, which adds lots of layers for the human player. It appears to add layers of confusion for the AI as despite the additions which should allow a more advanced civ, the AI is less competitive than it was. Their expansion is slower, sometimes much slower as is the infrastructure build. Their armies do remain numerous and dangerous, although the enhanced infrastructure/capabilities I can build makes them relatively less dangerous. As I like the additional complexity of DyP, I am looking for ways to make it more competitive. An additional trait for the AIs may do that or get part way there.

As for Theseus' questions, one was pretty well answered above (yes, there were ferociously strong AIs in LWC, not so much for DyP). I actually have never played at 3B years, mostly on 4B and occasionally 5B. Interested in your view on how playing at 3B would change the game.

[Karl]

Thoughts of being indutrious.

I have never seen my workers work too slow that has never been a problem, since they always r working the lands faster then city grows anyway. I know your thoughts on speed working r sound and logic, but its the speed of which the cities develop that is of crucial importance and they cant put up with the workers speed (when im playing) anyway. So I think u r overestimating this point. The cities will go to size 12 and stop growing until hospital even if u have the best workers, so the speed of development wont be that much greater with industriuos.
I think much is decided really early in the game, and A civ that has anything to offer then would be my choice.

[King of Rasslin]

I play "borg" city placement style, so I never have to move my workers very far. You really appreciate industrious when you start in a jungle, but otherwise you don't need it very much.

Now, Chinese archer rushes are another matter...