Armies -- Only Offensive?

[MrWhereItsAt]

If you've only got an army left then things are looking dicey. They're useful, but not all that useful isolated at the front of a war, and they used a GL (in most cases), so they are expensive enough you do NOT want to lose them. Always use an Army to support your main stack of individual units, or keep the army out of harm's way to passify/defend a city.

[Arrian]

I don't make defender armies much anymore. Sure, if there is a city or tile (luxury?) that I want to make absolutely sure, beyond all reasonable doubt, is safe, I'll stick a 3-4x infantry army on it.

The AI is generally afraid of armies. Even offensive armies. I've run around with a 3x Cavalry army in enemy territory, against an enemy that had Cavalry, and the AI went around it, rather than hit it. Me? I'd have hit that thing ASAP with Cav, and killed it. But the AI isn't like that. I think it is programmed to calculate combat odds for an individual battle (i.e. it's 1 cavalry unit against my 3x cav army), but not for multiple ones (i.e. 2 of its cavs hitting my army back to back). Clearly, it's worth a couple of cavalry to kill a 3x cav army. But the AI doesn't know that.

Another army that tends to be useful for stack defense and such is the 3x Legionary army (or even 2x legionary + 1x med inf). Those are nice toys. 12+ hp of 3 defense, like with the Cav army, the AI will be loathe to attack it.

My favorite mixed unit army is this: 3xTank + 1x Mech Inf. So balanced... no wasted movement points...

My favorite "pure" army? Well, Modern Armor, of course. But coming in second is the Samurai army. I don't recall ever pulling off a 4x elite* Samurai army (done it with Cav). Hmm...

-Arrian

p.s. As an aside, I am currently playing a game in which I've now seen 2 "properly made" AI armies. It used to be that I'd see an AI army and it would have like a knight, a spearman and a warrior in it. Somewhere along the line, I think Firaxis fixed that. Because both Egypt and Zululand have 3x Knight armies running around (too bad for the Zulu I'm on Egypt's side, and I've got Inf/Arty/Cav). I was pleased to see that.

[Solomwi]

Arrian, until just last week, my favorite pure army was Modern Armor, too. I have a new favorite now, though. The pure Marine Army retains its amphibious assault characteristics (PTW 1.21). I didn't know this, and don't know how many others did. Even though it ties up another Transport (I subscribe to the overwhelming force doctrine on amphib operations especially, and therefore want at least eight attacking Marines), this thing is great for knocking out that one Infantry unit, and letting your other Marines deal with Pikemen, Riflemen and Spearmen.

[trickey]

I agree with Arrian, the A.I does tend to shy away from armies all together, wheather they are offensive or defensive.

I don't usually make to many defensive armies, or many armies at all for that matter. The only way I can see myself making a defensive one is if I was planning a major assult on a city that was on another landmass. I would definatly not want to lose all my arty, so a 3-4 infantry army would be just what the doctor called for.

[Theseus]

Ohhh, yeah, I was gonna try another combo in AU 402... 2xBerzerk+Marine. Throwing that against a Spear is almost unfair. Makes me pant with lust.

[Shogun Gunner]

Originally posted by Theseus
Shogun, here ya go:

On the Utility and Use of Armies

Theseus, thanks for the link! That was a great discussion about armies...I see you all covered this ground previously...

All: many good suggestions. I'm going to try a few of them out. Look out you foolish Aztecs!!!

[Arrian]

Hmm, the Marine army could certainly have its uses.

It's just that I haven't researched the "Amphibious War" tech for, literally, years. Not since I was still learning the game. Once I played for a while, it became increasingly apparent that - in SP - true amphibious assaults were unecessary. It's easier to land on a mountain or hill (because the AI doesn't block them) and go from there.

-Arrian

[Theseus]

But, man, it's FUN!!!

[Solomwi]

Once I played for a while, it became increasingly apparent that - in SP - true amphibious assaults were unecessary. It's easier to land on a mountain or hill (because the AI doesn't block them) and go from there.

I can't really disagree, but the one thing that approach can't do is take the city this turn, which is why I've started back researching AW. I like to stay in Dem in the late game, as I'm generally not a religious civ, and going ahead and getting that port, and most likely two or three more cities even in bad circumstances, tends to give me a nice jump start on what I can accomplish before WW forces me to make peace. If, however, I'm cash strapped or the tech race is too tight, I could see AW getting de-prioritized.

Also, getting back on topic a bit... watching that Marine Army take down a fortified MI in a city of 22 is a thing of beauty.

[Theseus]

OOH RAH!!!

[Solomwi]

LOL! Of course, Theseus, you nailed the most important reason to use Marines... not only is the invasion fun, they make planning it fun, too.

[Jaybe]

Originally posted by Theseus
But, man, it's FUN!!!

Most Definitely!
On the Utility and Use of Marines

[cumi]

I use GL almost only for defensive purposes. I see no use of Army of MAs. MAs can attack three times and they are strong enough. If you load 3-4 strong defensive units, they are unbeatable.

You can walk through other empires with such an Army like a "wall" or a gigantic tsunamy (I am not sure if I spelled this correctly. I wanted to name the wave in the oceans generated by earthquake...or whatever...)

[Panag]

hi ,

, often its funny how the AI in ptw uses its armies , .....

they tend to be more offensive then defensive , has anyone ever done the numbers on it , .......

btw , using para's or your USMC when they are elite in an army really rocks , .......

thats an other thing you never see the AI do , loading elite units in an army , ......

Soren , .....

have a nice day

[vulture]

Originally posted by Solomwi
Arrian, until just last week, my favorite pure army was Modern Armor, too. I have a new favorite now, though. The pure Marine Army retains its amphibious assault characteristics (PTW 1.21). I didn't know this, and don't know how many others did.

Now that is good news which I'd somehow missed before. I think marine armies just gained a new spot in my list of favourite things to do in civ. Now if only paratroopers could do airborn assaults, with pure paratroop armies retaining the ability, we'd have another deadly offensive weapon.