Bye bye PtW

[vmxa1]

I think the biggest hit on AU402 was all the water. It caused lots of contients and lots of harbors. I think this was the main reason that turns could take a long time, with 24 civs.
It still took about 26 minutes on my 3.02 GH pc, if a city went down or was founded. If not, then some turns even late in the game could go in less than a minute. If a city was found/lost and wars were going on it could be painful. The same turns took nearly an hour on my 1.7 GH rig, if those events occurred.

[jshelr]

The thing I worry about with huge maps and all civs included is that trading tech becomes rediculous. You can get several times the research cost of a tech by selling it over and over again, as we found in the AU game. This hobbles the AI and makes victory certain, if also painfully long in achieving it due to the processing time needed. Maybe you can develop an idea for getting around that, with prohibition of the human player selling tech the only dumb thought that occurs to me.

[Datajack Franit]

You must have a kickass computer but let us informet about that

[notyoueither]

I am interested in this. Sir Ralph, could you PM me when you are starting?

[Harovan]

Ok, I finished the mod. Here are all changes I made, and the mod itself, for those, who want to try a random map. The mod allows every map size, even tiny, just these map sizes are larger than their originals and allow more civs.

Bye Bye PtW mod


General Settings
================
- Minimum Research Time 5
- Maximum Research Time 50

Terrain
=======
- Added the ability of hills to have uranium and gems
- Removed all resources except gold from mountains
- Removed the roading bonus from mountains and added 1 commerce to the standard tile values
- Removed the Allow Cities flag from desert, tundra, forest and jungle
- Made ocean impassable for wheeled units

Units
=====
- Marine changed to 10.6.1, +1 HP, cost 12
- Paratrooper changed to 8.8.2, +1 HP, cost 12, range 8
- Guerilla has hidden nationality and can build forts
- Archer and Bowman have range 0 bombardment of 2
- Longbowman and Berserk have range 0 bombardment of 4
- Knights and Samurai are wheeled
- Keshiks ignore movement cost on mountains and hills
- War Elephants ignore movement cost in forest and jungle
- Cavalry, Cossack and Sipahi are wheeled
- Tank, Panzer, Mechanized Infanry, Modern Armor are wheeled
- Radar Artillery is wheeled and has movement 2
- Cruise Missile is wheeled, can be loaded and have range 4
- Galley is wheeled
- Caravel has 4 movement
- Frigate, Galleon, Man-O-War and Submarine have 5 movement
- Ironclad is wheeled
- Carrier and Battleship and Nuclear Submarine have 6 movement
- Transport, Destroyer and AEGIS Cruiser have 7 movement
- Destroyers can detect invisible and carry 1 tactical missile
- Nuclear Submarine can carry 2 missiles
- Fighter has range 6
- Bomber, Helicopter, Jet Fighter and F-15 have range 8
- Stealth Fighter has range 12, bombard strength 6, lethal sea bombardement, has his load flag

removed and can intercept
- Stealth Bomber has range 16, lethal sea and land bombardement, has his load flag removed
- Catapult, Cannon, Hwach'a, Artillery, Radar Artillery and Leader can be airlifted

World Sizes
===========
- Tiny 80 x 80 6 civs 250 TechRate
- Small 100 x 100 9 civs 312 TechRate
- Standard 120 x 120 12 civs 375 TechRate
- Large 160 x 160 18 civs 500 TechRate
- Huge 200 x 200 24 civs 625 TechRate

[Harovan]

And for those who want to have the same game like me, here's my start. Settings are huge (200x200), 24 civs, raging barbarians, continents, normal, temperate, 3 billion years, emperor. And since I didn't play them since that famous early AU game (was it AU102? Somewhere there), it's the Germans for me. They have an ok builder and a good warmonger trait and an awesome UU so late, that I actually may make it through the industrial age without abandoning the game, just to get it.

[Harovan]

That's how it looks:

[Snotty]

Wow, Looks fantastic. Ive really been looking forward to this. Thanks!

[Rhothaerill]

I don't know how soon I'll be able to get to this (I'll be busy and then on vacation most of the week), but it definitely sounds interesting.

[Soren Johnson]

I know you already got started, but I would recommend getting rid of the no cities on forests or jungles. The AI will not know to chop down forests/jungles to create a suitable city spot...

[Master Zen]

Re: Bye bye PtW

- Stealth aircraft can't be carrier based

How do you plan on doing this? I've tried taking out the load capability but they still seem to be able to load on carriers (perhaps this a bug with past versions, haven't tested it with 1.27).

[Harovan]

Wow, first class guests here. Hi Soren, I'm having fun with your AI .

I used my free Sunday (and the fact, that my wife took care for the guests we have at the moment), and played till deep in the medieval age. My experiences so far:

- The AI is doing fine. Some AIs are (as expected) fledgling, but that happens under normal map conditions too. Others are wealthy and strong. I am on a large continent with 10 AIs. Mostly European ones, since cultural linking is on. England (wow!) and France are the tech leaders and very strong. Russia and Spain are fairly strong too, the rest are mediocre.

- The AI is definitely hurt by the city building restriction, but then, so am I. Even if you have brains and the AI only some formulas and algorithms, chopping lots of forest and clearing jungle with a non-industrious civ isn't exactly fun if you are REXing. I'm thinking of dropping the restriction to settle at forest for the next game (probably named "Hello Conquests"). It was primarily designed to prevent the human player from cheating (planting on tundra and then settling). But the restriction on jungle is fine.

- Playing civ with large unsettled areas is fun! I have to repeat this and to emphasize: Playing civ with large unsettled areas is fun! I have a vast (several hundred tiles) jungle to my south. It is full of barbarians and soldiers of literally all countries are roaming there. The AI uses jungle tactics very well! If some of her medinfs or longbowmen are hurt, they run away from my knights in the jungle. And laugh at me from there, I can hear it.

- The AI is aggressive like hell. I never experienced this! I'm basically under siege for the whole game so far. In the ancient age a 4-civ alliance attacked me (the usual extortion thing with being sent to hell). That was fine with me, because 3 of the civs were on the other side of the vast continent, and the 4th was my neighbor Carthage, whom I wanted to attack anyway. Took 2 cities. After this, in the north the Vikings and Spaniards were attacking, with large streams of pikes, archers and medinfs.

In the south I'm under permanent russian siege. It's amazing! I never saw anything similar. Russia attacks, I push back the attack, take a city or 2 and make peace, as usual. But 1 or 2 turns after the peace treaty, Russia sneak attacks me again! She repeated this 3 times already! The first 2 times I extorted gold per turn and went to her limit with my demands. I thought this is the reason for the quick attack and made the 3rd peace treaty on the even. But no, it'S 2 turns after we signed peace, and her knights are again at my territory. What shall I do? I will have to wipe her out, although I don't want to do so.

- The load flag trick with the carrier based planes does not work.

[Master Zen]

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
- The load flag trick with the carrier based planes does not work.

Damn

you know any other sneaky way to get certain plains not be carrier-based?

[vmxa1]

Sir Ralph, give a screenie or two now and again.

[Harovan]

Originally posted by Master Zen
you know any other sneaky way to get certain plains not be carrier-based?

Unfortunately not.

Originally posted by vmxa1
Sir Ralph, give a screenie or two now and again.

Will do.