T I M E C O U N T E R

[Randolph]

Is the whole "green hours" thing really necessary?

There are some really good ideas in this system, but when it comes down to it I think a straight forward "total time team X has had the save" would be most useful.

Not to put too much pressure on though, it's very nice as is, and I appreciate all the work Borc has put into it.

[GhengisFarb™]

Originally posted by Randolph
Is the whole "green hours" thing really necessary?

There are some really good ideas in this system, but when it comes down to it I think a straight forward "total time team X has had the save" would be most useful.

Not to put too much pressure on though, it's very nice as is, and I appreciate all the work Borc has put into it.

Yes it is, I have no desire to get up every 30 miutes in the middle of the night to check my email to see if I have been sent the game save.

The green hours are a safety period where that team can get some sleep.

[Randolph]

yes but it would all average out anyway (we would expect some delays due to sleep)

[Harovan]

Randolph: This would be true if everybody was in the same timezone. But that's not the case.

Imagine: I'm in Europe, my predecessor is in America and sends the game in his evening. That'll be night for me. In the morning, before work, I usually don't have the time to browse the threads and to play a turn. That means, the game has to wait till my evening. The team would lose at least 12 hours every turn, because the situation doesn't change: Next turn will be sent during my night again, as my predecessor has not changed.

The green hours are good. For those who work (should be most of us) they are even too short.

[GhengisFarb™]

Originally posted by Randolph
yes but it would all average out anyway (we would expect some delays due to sleep)

It doesn't average out, the first 2-3 weeks Borc (who lives in Europe) would play and send me the save at 2:00 am my time, when I was asleep. Trip would receive the game in the afternoon his time because he received it from someone in his time zone.

The only fair way to do the counter was to give each team green hours during the time they were asleep.

[Randolph]

OK, I see the point (I work and sleep). I suppose my perspective is a bit off since I don't actually play.

My instinct is that I like to receive (relatively) raw data and make interpretations myself rather than have interpretations forced by the way the data is presented. I can determine myself that "X was sleeping/working during that period".

Having the green hours hides underlying inefficiencies in the system. For example if we're losing 12 hours each “full turn” because an individual’s turn always comes right when he/she gets to work (or goes to bed), we might (*might*) be able to do something to improve the overall efficiency (use a second player, get the previous team to send the turn an hour earlier, etc).

It depend on whether this is to be a tool for analyzing the efficiency of the system, or a method of dealing out blame. Unfortunately I have to agree that it is more likely to be used as the latter. Finally I don’t think it “needs to be changed”, I just wanted to point out my take.

[Randolph]

Originally posted by GhengisFarb

It doesn't average out, the first 2-3 weeks Borc (who lives in Europe) would play and send me the save at 2:00 am my time, when I was asleep. Trip would receive the game in the afternoon his time because he received it from someone in his time zone.

The only fair way to do the counter was to give each team green hours during the time they were asleep.

You’re certainly right here. I was greatly underestimating the amount of pattern there would be in the time of arrival. I was assuming that arrival time would be largely random, which is obviously not true.

[vondrack]

Originally posted by Randolph
It depend on whether this is to be a tool for analyzing the efficiency of the system, or a method of dealing out blame. Unfortunately I have to agree that it is more likely to be used as the latter. Finally I don’t think it “needs to be changed”, I just wanted to point out my take.

Well, I believe that so far it was used neither for former, neither for latter. Nobody made any blaming and I'd be careful to speak about any efficiency analysis... I think it is just fine to have a simple means of seeing who's actually slowing the game down most. I believe we are all reasonable people and those that happen to fall behind will understand/use it as a reminder to do something to get back in line (well, yes, I am speaking of ourselves, too...).

[Randolph]

Originally posted by vondrack

I think it is just fine to have a simple means of seeing who's actually slowing the game down most.

This is what I meant by "dealing out blame"

[Jon Shafer]

I was just checking something, and the Time Counter says that the green hours are from 12am until 7am of the primary player, right? Well why do the green hours start from 1am my time (8am GMT), instead of midnight?

[vondrack]

Also, IIRC, Sir Ralph is in Europe, so he can't be GMT-7 or whetever US time it is listed there (and consequently, GS green hours must be completely wrong now). Borc, I believe you corrected the names of GS players after Sir Ralph took over from nye, but did not adjust the time zones accordingly, did you?

[Eli]

Sweet. 14 hours for 2850BCE.

[Harovan]

Originally posted by vondrack
Also, IIRC, Sir Ralph is in Europe, so he can't be GMT-7 or whetever US time it is listed there (and consequently, GS green hours must be completely wrong now). Borc, I believe you corrected the names of GS players after Sir Ralph took over from nye, but did not adjust the time zones accordingly, did you?

I asked Borc to leave the green hours, where they are. Right now I'm at vacation and mostly am up the whole night (today went to bed 8:30am), and from Jan 13 on I will be working during these hours, making it impossible to make our turn too. NYEs green hours are definitely fine with me.

[Thrumble]

Originally posted by Trip
I was just checking something, and the Time Counter says that the green hours are from 12am until 7am of the primary player, right? Well why do the green hours start from 1am my time (8am GMT), instead of midnight?

The Time Counter also states for you to inform Borc if you would like to change the time period of your green hours.

[Jon Shafer]

Yes, I saw that, but the default green hours should be correct... by default.