Knowledgeyou don't understand

[Tim White]

I am totally for it rremus!!

[UltraSonix]

Off topic, but to:

quote: (and are there any girls ????)

Empress is the only is one who I know occasionally looks into this forum. The rest of the girls are in OT.

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No, in Australia we don't live with kangaroos and koalas in our backyards... Despite any stupid advertisments you may see to the contrary...

[Vrank Prins]

Rremus,

As you can see I have read this thread. I couldn't agree more with what Ultrasonix (and all the others) said, what an excellent idea, good show old chap .
To all the other guys (and are there any girls ????) out there, the same point has come up in the thread war & progress. So if you want to read some other thoughts about the consequences of this idea, go there!
While reading my printout from this I got some idea's I need to work out some more. Also in connection to what I have said in the thread war & progress.
[This message has been edited by Vrank Prins (edited October 23, 2000).]

[rremus]

Another idea I had is related to how you treat your scientists: If you have no science funds allocated for a small number of turns, your scientists should desert and and sell your knowledges to other civs.

[Biddles]

This is the only idea in ages worth mentioning. Good work rremus.

Only one suggestion: Maybe when you get these "unknown research and applied information" you decided that it may be of some benefit to look into this. Since you have the engineering advance this is possible. Next time you have to pick a tech to investigate you pick "reverse engineer unknown research and applied information fron CivX". This would eneable you to back discover the techs neccesary for that advance, maybe with a small bonus brcause you have something to work with (20%?). Of course you wouldn't get any of the tech advances until you have uncovered the lowest ones.

Well, that's for people who want realism. I think (as a UoP player) the idea is great anyway.


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- Biddles

"Now that our life-support systems are utilising the new Windows 2027 OS, we don't have to worry about anythi......."
Mars Colonizer Mission

[cityhelper]

Great idea! It just seems so stupid when diplomats/spies can steal Space Flight knowledge, put a space ship in the air but not even have the knowledge to build basic airplanes and rockets! This is so very annoying in my humble opinion.

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Justin Hall
Cityhelper.com Travel
www.Cityhelper.com
(Discount Travel Specialist)

[rremus]

quote: Originally posted by Biddles on 10-27-2000 10:04 PM This would eneable you to back discover the techs neccesary for that advance, maybe with a small bonus brcause you have something to work with (20%?).

You mean research "reverese engineer X" and your scientist should research the tech tree that leads to X? I'm not sure about this. What if the tech tree consist of 10 or so technologies? You don't know what X is, yet! You start reverse engineering it, then the research can take a LOT of time, because, it needs to reasearch (even with 20% bonuses!) all the 10 advances you need to understand X!
How about this: a 20% bonus on researching any of the 10 advances that leads to X. It can work like this: you got X somehow (coquest, exchange). If you select 'Reverse engineer X', it should be a fairly complex task (100-200 science bulbs). Once you achieve it, you know the name of X and the advances you need to research to get X have a 10-20% bonus. But you still have to research them individually. This bonus should be, of course, displayed when you select a new advance to research.
Also, the bonuses should be cumulative. If two unknown advances require Y and you reverse engineered both of them, then Y gets bonus twice.

However, I think this model is a little bit too complicated... I would be happy if at least they implement the model when you cannot understand something you aquire and is beyond your level of knowledge.
Regards,
Remus
[This message has been edited by rremus (edited October 30, 2000).]

[Biddles]

Yeah, I see your point. Scrap Reverse engineering altogether. But the idea about to advanced techs should definetly be in civ3.

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- Biddles

"Now that our life-support systems are utilising the new Windows 2027 OS, we don't have to worry about anythi......."
Mars Colonizer Mission

[UltraSonix]

I think they do see the threads, they just lurk and don't respond... at least that what I'm hoping they're doing!

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No, in Australia we don't live with kangaroos and koalas in our backyards... Despite any stupid advertisments you may see to the contrary...

[Tiberius]

Bump...

It's one very, very good idea. I think Firaxis should see it.

[Paulypav]

How about a real simple solution. You can't steal or obtain a technology if you don't have the prerequisite technology for it. If you've got the technology then its all yours. If you've done all the research leading up to a new advance then you are likely to be able to figure it out. The russians couldn't have copied our plans if they didn't already have certain technological developments.

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"In war, there is no substitute for victory."
- Douglas MacArthur

[rremus]

Yes, I think thats fair enough. The game should enforce this rule: when you negotiate a technologiy exchange, it should offer you only technologies at your current level. When you still technologies, also should be able to steal only the technologies you can understant.
This will work of course as long as the AI WONT'CHEAT (as it does so often now!). If the AI also follow this rule, any AI civ will have only complete technology 'trees' (no missing links), so you will always have a technology to steal or obtain if they have something more advanced that you.

[Biddles]

I agree on the tech trade part, only offer techs that the civ has pre-req's for. I hated when you were the first to get gunpowder, and whenever you traded techs, that was all any other civ would take.


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- Biddles

"Now that our life-support systems are utilising the new Windows 2027 OS, we don't have to worry about anythi......."
Mars Colonizer Mission

[Maccabee2]

"How about a real simple solution. You can't steal or obtain a technology if you don't have the prerequisite technology for it. If you've got the technology then its all yours. If you've done all the research leading up to a new advance then you are likely to be able to figure it out. The russians couldn't have copied our plans if they didn't already have certain technological developments."

Wow! Great idea! This should definitely be in Civ3!

[rremus]

bump!