What does Rifleman represent?

[Deathwalker]

What technological and tactical standard does an Rifleman unit represent?
Is it more along the lines off the units that fought in the American Civil War or War Of Independance?

[Dinner]

He's dressed up like a civil war soldier.

[The Pioneer]

I guess it would be civil war ery and the musketeer would be like the War of Independence. I do not find rifleman worth the trouble in this game because it's too close to the Infantry which is wayyyyy more powerful.

[Barchan]

I'd have to agree that they represent the state of Infantry forces from the mid-to-late 1800's. Prior to the 1800's most weapons were flintlock (or other type) ignition, muzzle-loading, powder-wadding-ball style rifles. Percussion caps were invented in the early 1800's but weren't widely used until the mid 1800's. During the US Civil War (1861-1865) percussion cartridges were used, but the weapons were largely still muzzle-loaders and the “cartridges” tended to be paper rolls containing a premixed measure of powder, wadding and a .45 caliber ball. Modern metallic cartridges weren't used until the 1870's, and by the end of the century many of the modern rifles used in WWI and WWII had been designed and built (the German Mauser K-98 rifle used throughout WWII was designed in 1898).

True, Riflemen are rather quickly made obsolete in most games. But then again, the weapons they’re based on went obsolete pretty quickly too. Muzzle-loading muskets were used for almost 400 years before the first paper cartridge breech-loaders came about in the mid-1800s, and they were almost entirely replaced a mere 50 years later with newer metallic cartridge, bolt-action clip fed modern rifles. Still, they have a longer lifespan than piston-powered Fighters.

[WarpStorm]

Riflemen can also be built without rubber.

[dunk]

I only build riflemen if I am playing as a scientific civ. I almost always go directly for Replaceable Parts once in the industrial age. Then I go for Electronics. Then Motorized Transportation.

[Deathwalker]

Thanx

[The Pioneer]

Originally posted by WarpStorm
Riflemen can also be built without rubber.

I've modded mine, you need Saltpeper and Iron. I've actually modded a lot of my unit, so that resources become even more important.

[DeepO]

But... the whole point of the rifleman in civ is that you get a resource free unit! If you mod it to require saltpeter and iron, the only unit you can fall back on if a city is not connected is the warrior... which is hardly a match for tanks. At least the riflemen have some chance of defending a closed in city.

DeepO

[EvilKosh]

Originally posted by DeepO
But... the whole point of the rifleman in civ is that you get a resource free unit! If you mod it to require saltpeter and iron, the only unit you can fall back on if a city is not connected is the warrior... which is hardly a match for tanks. At least the riflemen have some chance of defending a closed in city.

DeepO

But tanks will tremble if you defend your city with a speaman . Must be those spearheads wedging in the gears or something.

[N. Machiavelli]

Originally posted by DeepO
But... the whole point of the rifleman in civ is that you get a resource free unit! If you mod it to require saltpeter and iron, the only unit you can fall back on if a city is not connected is the warrior... which is hardly a match for tanks. At least the riflemen have some chance of defending a closed in city.

DeepO

True enough in purely balanced terms. But isn't it a bit silly, when thinking outside the Civ 'box', that "saltpeter has become so abundant" that it isn't an issue with Riflemen, yet you still need it for Cavelry?

I've made Riflemen dependant upon Saltpeter, though not Iron as Pioneer has done.

[DeepO]

Outside of the civ box? No... nowadays saltpeter is indeed still won from mines, but it is perfectly possible to make it yourself. All you need is Nitrogen from the air, and some kind of pressurised acid. I won't comment on if this procedure was known around the US civil war (probably not), but you don't need saltpeter anymore for infantry, and the basis of their explosives would also be a nitrogenous compound. Maybe it's not perfectly historically accurate, but it's not much wrong either...

DeepO

[Optimizer]

About the Saltpeter issue:

This is why you should be able to make buildings that produce resources!

Then Riflemen could still require Saltpeter, and there would be a Nitrate Factory that produced all the Saltpeter your civ would ever need!

Same with Horses - if you buy Horses from another civ, you should be able to build a Stud Farm to produce your own horses.

[DeepO]

No, I don't agree. I mean, it's a nice idea to have buildings that can make resources (which would work for horses, saltpeter, rubber, but not for the others), but the whole point of the rifleman is that it requires no resources at all. If you have one city, completely surrounded by hostile territory, you are still able to draft some rifleman in there. It might not be historically accurate, but it is a much needed thing when you're in an underdog position.

The same when in the middle of a war: the enemy may take all your resources by either bombardment or conquering, and you still have the possibility to keep your ground with the riflemen. This game mechanic should not be abandonned, if only to keep some options open for the AI when you're too good for them. On the contrary, I fully agree with Vel, in that each era should get such a resource free unit, instead of only the industrial rifleman and the ancient spearman.

DeepO

[Optimizer]

Maybe you could have a Militia unit that requires no resources.