What are keys lessons for each difficulty jump?

[planetfall]

Ever get tired of never learning this game and asking tons of questions? Oh, well here goes, again. Curious as to what the normal learning curve looks like.

chieftain
need to learn basics of game


chieftain->warlord
new lessons that need to be mastered
-- happiness
-- basic diplomacy

warlord->regent
new lessons that need to be mastered
??
??

regent->monarch
new lessons that need to be mastered
??
??

monarch->emperor
new lessons that need to be mastered
??
??

emperor->diety
new lessons that need to be mastered
??
??

Just started my first regent level game. It is feeling strange. Here is what I am discovering:
1. typical avg start
-- 1:2 civs on continent.
-- only 1 luxury on start continent
-- no horses!!
-- no navigation beyond continent without sacrificing galleys

2. early archer gambit works just as well at regent as at warlord

3. problems increased
-- corruption
-- happiness
-- improvements build order delayed

4. resulting play changes
-- may change standard expansion build order to deal with corruption and happiness
-- may delay transition out of depositism in order to count military as one happy face
-- courthouses are suddenly much earlier in build order
-- coliseums are now included in build order
-- FP must be built ASAP, early in middle ages
-- if switch to republic too early, happiness slider needs to move from 10 to 30%
-- management of city production balance needs to reviewed at least every two turns
-- no longer can switch between war for techs and research techs but must plan on trading or purchasing techs.
-- have to start sacrificing pop for build queue



Questions:
1. Are these normal reactions to this level jump?

2. What are the key new skills to acquire at regent level?

3. Suggestions?


4. Aside, how did my status change from "settler" to "prince", number of posts?

[Slax]

You'll need to play more games to decide what is 'typical', but this is a very interesting idea for a thread. I am thinking of moving from Regent to Monarch and i am wondering what to expect, too.

As to what is a typical start position, I am playing a game at Regent, and I started on a nice grass & jungle continent. The Romans share it with me, but expanded so much slower, now I have control of 80% of the continent. I have links to 3 different luxuries, plus horses and iron. Also it seems there are islands i can get to with galleys.

So I can't say how much of your starting position is difficulty-related.

You do need to worry about corruption and happiness (although I control happiness through improvements, wonders and luxury resources, and never set the luxury slider > 0).

[SomeOneElse]

it is difficult moving up difficulty levels. you learn to beat the game blindfolded on one level, and it seems to beat you at everything you do next level. i only recently got a handle on monarchy, and can hold my own, but have not surpassed it completely.

[Arrian]

In my experience, there are two major factors which require the most adjustment:

1) Happiness (or lack thereof)

2) Tech progress

As you advance up the difficulty ladder, it is more difficult to keep your citizens happy, and you have less time to do things. The tech race speeds up the higher you go, and you have shorter and shorter windows of opportunity to do certain things.

I'm stubborn. My response to the tech rate once I got to Monarch? I started breaking things. I used to be a builder. Not anymore. No time. I've dabbled with Emperor, and I have even less time to do things there. An attempt at early warfare failed, due to the fact that on Emperor, 350bc isn't "early." It's the start of the middle ages.

I picked up a game my girlfriend started on Regent lately, and it felt like I had all the time in the world to do things. I could build and fight - at the same time!

The other response to the tech situation is to buy tech off the AI until your economy is properly set up and you can begin researching toward a tech lead. You can do this. I, due to the aforementioned stubborn streak, hate paying the AI for tech, but it certainly works. I'd just rather beat it out of them.

-Arrian

[Panag]

hi ,

, intresting , ......

, a lot can depend on the setting of the "default" AI level , .....

have a nice day

[dunk]

Let's see...

Warlord to Regent (where I play)...

Commerce Management... You have to do this correctly, lest you fall behind in tech. Regent is where the player and the AI are on even footing in terms of handicaps.

Advanced Diplomacy... You need to get new techs as soon as possible, even if it means contacting the AI civs almost every turn. Failure to do so can result in lost wonders and an obsolete military.

Alliance / MPP Manipulation... At warlord and chieftan, it isn't too difficult to clobber an AI opponent, or even 3 at one time, alone. At Regent, you'll need to get the AI to do a big share of the dirty work, and clean up the survivors (on both sides).

Full Assault Forces... Bring defensive units along with your attackers to hold your conquered territory, because there's usually going to be a large counterattack coming after your first wave.

[dunk]

Originally posted by panag
hi ,

, intresting , ......

, a lot can depend on the setting of the "default" AI level , .....

have a nice day

What specifically does this setting change? I've seen you mention it numerous times.

[Apolex]

I moved from Emperor to Diety recently and won my first game. It was definitely difficult to master, because you have to overcome ENORMOUS cheating by the AI.

Things I learned I MUST do, that I didn't necessarily have to do in Emp:

1. Early Ancient Era militaristic take-over/weaking of at least 2 nearby civs. If you don't do this you're already toast. Might as well Ctrl-Shft-Q it. Building settlers is useless because by the time it's produced, the other AI civs have already established 4 cities a piece. You have to get your cities via conquest, even that early.

2. Take all their tech. Because you will NEVER keep up with AIs tech on your own. Set science to zero through much of the game and use money / wars to get tech.

3. Become a foriegn policy Puppet-master. Found it a necessity to keep the other powerful civs distracted and wasting their resources fighting each other. Used money and bribes to start wars against the most powerful opponents and then stepped back and let them all weaken each other. Frequently propped up weaker civs so other's wouldn't get too powerful. I once gave mobile warfare AND my only source of oil to the Japanese for 20 turns so they could fight off a complete take-over by the powerful French. While they were fighting a stalemate I worked on domestically improving my civ with powerplants, factories, etc.

4. Luck. Don't need it to win in Emp. but you do in Diety.

-Apolex

[Panag]

Originally posted by dunk999


What specifically does this setting change? I've seen you mention it numerous times.

hi ,

well , many things , for one or the other reason the AI acts different , its like he use's his units in a more tactical way , tends to get more for the dollar , is more agressive , goes after your luxury , but with a more intresting way , ....

there has been loads of talk , but one thing is for sure , when you use it , and with a deity yourself , it is more the less acceptable , ....
put then basic barbarian as rifleman , advanced as infantry and the sea unit as a destroyer , with them at raging , you are of for a spin , .... , .......

when you put the comp at deity , but dont know it that good , you can always give yourself more units , or less for the comp , .....

making a map for yourself is also fun , it take's time but its nice and lots of fun , ....

have a nice day

[planetfall]

Apolex-- thank you for the hard core suggestions. As I am slowly, painfully moving up the levels, it is becoming more and more apparent the only way to win is:
1. fight a lot
2. use a lot of bartering
3. redirect AI's to self destruction
4. ignore most research.

It is so ironic. Take the way you are told to play the game and then do the opposite, or die.

[Panag]

Originally posted by planetfall
Apolex-- thank you for the hard core suggestions. As I am slowly, painfully moving up the levels, it is becoming more and more apparent the only way to win is:
1. fight a lot
2. use a lot of bartering
3. redirect AI's to self destruction
4. ignore most research.

It is so ironic. Take the way you are told to play the game and then do the opposite, or die.

hi ,

, the more research , the more power , ....

one thing to use is "peace true power" , .....

tip , try to start ones with more tech and a bit more money , and maybe in a certain age , ...

have a nice day

[dnassman]

At any level I play at up to and including Emperor I ALWAYS take out as many civs around me as possible. I believe it is the only way to be dominant especially in the higher levels. I pound as many as I can to death early on.

[Theseus]

In addition to Arrian's comments, PF, it is obvious from the many comments that early warfare, no, early damage to nearby civs, becomes very important as you progress up-level.

I would add to the above comments that setting a game strategy and beelining for techs becomes very important as well.

Typical early beelines:
Iron Working
The Wheel / Horseback Riding
Mapmaking
Literature
Monarchy or The Republic

In that latest "Civ3 ain't great" thread, someone made the point that there is little strategy differentiation because you need to do everything well; I disagree somewhat... you need to pick a game-specific strat and execute that extremely well, especially on the higher levels.

[Not that I don;t get my ass kicked with regularity]

[Barchan]

Originally posted by panag
one thing to use is "peace true power" , .....

Unless you're a pacifist, it's "peace through power".

Now, if you're from New York City, you might pronounce "through" as "true", but you should still write it as "through". After all, it is only by maintaining some basic commonality of language that we'll ever be able to understand one another. Of course, some people will always be enigmas....

[Cookie Monster]

Hi all,

Just thought I'd share some of my experiences with you.

I've been stuck at regent level for the longest time now. 1.21f is nearly perfect but it is a great challenge. Haven't been able to win on this level, except for maybe one or two times with a high score at the end. And that was just plain dumb luck I think.

Anyway, I've realized what my errors have been since making the transition from chieftain to regent. It has to do with not trading/beating tech out of the AI properly, and poor T/S/L rate management. Let me explain briefly.

I think one problem I have that needs correcting is right at the very beginning. Early war is vital to gaining the advantage. You need to either beat tech out of your neighbors while maintaining the military edge over them until the end of the game. Kill them off at the right time, meaning when they have given everything they can to you and can't give any more. So my mistake is this; I have been trying to set up 4 cities in addition to my capital before engaging in war with my neighbors. I believe that three cities in addition to the capital would be enough. The extra time I waste producing that fourth settler more often than not costs me the game. I don't have the proper strength to beat people up and as a consequence fall behind in tech. Then I die around the late industrial to early modern age.

Another mistake I've been making is not adjusting my rate sliders after I've built up my infrastructure. Sure you can max out your money rate and just buy or beat tech out of the AI, however....After you reach the late medieval/early industrial tech's become so expensive and the AI is usually unwilling to sell them to you. You are technilogically inferior and can't even beat them up at this point. In other words, "game over man!!!!"

What I realize is you must adjust the rate sliders to slowly shift from making beaucou (sp?) money to bringing up your science rate. Then you will still be able to have decent techs to use to beat up your opponents and extort whatever from them for the rest of the game.

Now I must go, get through another day at work, and then give my ideas a try. Hopefully I'm right about this, we'll find out.