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  • AI and slightly modded units - good news

    I have now almost finished a game which I played with something new to my mod, slight changed to the Modern Age units. Took me several games, actually, to get to the period where this would matter.

    Three most important changes affect these units:

    Cruise Missile - increased bombard range to 4, slightly increased bombard power, added Precision Strike ability (a-la real life). Battleships can carry 2 Cruisse Missiles.

    Marine - A/D/M is now 12/8/1, and the Marine has 2 extra HP, that is, a regular one has 5 already.

    Paatrooper - A/D/M is 10/8/1, range increased. Patatoopers also get 2 extra HP, like the Marine, to make it possible to hang out in the field with those. A 8 defender with extra HP can be quite mean.

    So, in the late Industrial Age, I went to Marines before Tanks, and made heavy use of them as field fighters. In the Modern Age, I had a nice missile defense system set up, with quite some Cruise Missiles, and most of my Battleships carrying one, too.

    And, in late Industrial and Modern Ages wars started coming en masse. I was very surprised to see the Greeks deliver a Transport full of Marines to the Roman coast and make an amphibious assault, also later using those Marines in ground combat.

    As I kept checking, Alexander had about half a dozen Paratroopers, too (I've never seen the AI build any before), and I've even once saw them actually make an airdrop.

    Most pleasing of all, was the AI use of Cruise Missiles. Again, I didn't see the AI use those much, but when I invaded the Aztecs with some Modern Armor, Montezuma rained about 10 Cruise Missiles, killing 8 Modern Armor (I said I made them powerful!).

    Let me summarize this: the AI does use units it otherwise wouldn't if they're toned up significantly. Most people don't use the Marines, Cruise Missiles and Paratroopers as they are out of the box either, so the AI doesn't.

    I have also powered the subs up, and saw some increase in AI sub tactics, too.

    Very pleased .
    Solver, WePlayCiv Co-Administrator
    Contact: solver-at-weplayciv-dot-com
    I can kill you whenever I please... but not today. - The Cigarette Smoking Man

  • #2
    Congratulations on your success with the "elite" infantries! Did you also adjust their production costs?

    The hidden power of Cruise Missiles (un-modded, even) is that if you shoot them at a city, they hit the combatants. Makes them quite valuable if you want to keep a city/metro which you hope hasn't been drafted and oppressed to the hilt.

    (Or have I just been extra lucky with cruise missiles??)

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    • #3
      No, I didn't change any production costs. The Marine already costs the same as Tank, but now it's adequate.

      Hmm, haven't used Cruise Missiles as-is before much, especially on cities. But with the weak power and short range, it wasn't much of a use.
      Solver, WePlayCiv Co-Administrator
      Contact: solver-at-weplayciv-dot-com
      I can kill you whenever I please... but not today. - The Cigarette Smoking Man

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      • #4
        Re: AI and slightly modded units - good news

        Originally posted by Solver
        I was very surprised to see the Greeks deliver a Transport full of Marines to the Roman coast and make an amphibious assault, also later using those Marines in ground combat.
        I am a fan of marines, but have never seen the AI use them in an amphibious assault (have seen them used plenty of times in place of a tank when AI has no oil).

        I have always wanted to stimulate the AI to atack amphibiously (so at least the threat is there!), but haven't really been successful with my (much slighter) mods. Great job! and thanks for the info. I may make some similar changes just to see some AI amphibious assaults.

        Catt

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        • #5
          Glad to encourage some people to try what I've modded .
          Solver, WePlayCiv Co-Administrator
          Contact: solver-at-weplayciv-dot-com
          I can kill you whenever I please... but not today. - The Cigarette Smoking Man

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          • #6
            Solver, is adding 2 HPs not unbalancing to the game? I agree Marines do not have the same chance of promotions, as they're only used once (or twice), but making elites out of them no matter where they're built, isn't that too much?

            Question in between: did any of your elite marines gave a GL, and if so where did it appear (i.e. on the transport)?

            Further, if you managed to get the AIs to use marines and paratroopers, either the stats should be changed in the next patch, or some incentive should be given so that the AI would try it more. It would bring some much needed diversity in the AI, apparantly without any new coding (the routines for amphibious assault are clearly present).

            DeepO

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            • #8
              I think I remember Vel saying something about how the AI get evil if you make a ground unit with hidden nationality. Any comments on this?

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              • #9
                Originally posted by DeepO
                Solver, is adding 2 HPs not unbalancing to the game? I agree Marines do not have the same chance of promotions, as they're only used once (or twice), but making elites out of them no matter where they're built, isn't that too much?
                DeepO - I believe you can give specific unit classes a base number of hitpoints without changing their status from regular, veteran, etc. In other words, giving marines a 5 HP base means you will create a 5 HP regular marine (which can be promoted to a 6 HP veteran and 7 HP elite). There is no shortcut to creating elite units without combat. Could be wrong, but this is what I recall from the editor.

                Catt

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                • #10
                  Catt says right, it's just that my Regular marines have 5 HP, and get 6 HP when promoted to Veteran. The two leaders I generated from my Elite, 7 HP marines were when they were already on ground.

                  Hmm, I have a SAV file lying somewhere near, it is from that game, but not for the right situation . I can post the bic, though, will be useful with the "June patch", as you will then easily see what I've done.

                  Deep O - the AI surely uses some kind of a unit evaluation formula to determine if it's worth using. No surprise than, with Tanks available, the Marine wasn't too high on the AI priority list. However, with boosted stats, AI gave it enough consideration, and then came the extra bonus due to the amphibious flag, which made the AI decide in favor of Marines.

                  BTW, I believe there should be another Modern unit, like Drop Mech, that is, a mech unit executing airdrops, something with stats a bit lower than a Mech Inf.
                  Solver, WePlayCiv Co-Administrator
                  Contact: solver-at-weplayciv-dot-com
                  I can kill you whenever I please... but not today. - The Cigarette Smoking Man

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                  • #11
                    I've been toying with the unit stats, in order to give every unit a place in the game myself.

                    Gave Nuclear sub ability to bombard- It got used in a big way by the AI - But had no real way to couter it being as it was a real pain to find the subs that were bombarding me - So I gave Helicopters the ability to see subs. Worked well.

                    I spead up all naval unit, except for the galley. Made the use of naval warfare and amphidious assaults more usable rather than taking ten years to reach your target drop area.

                    Tanks Light Armor so that they could not be upgraded, instead I made them as a foot unit so it could be air dropped.

                    Gave workers a movement of 2 to speed them up a bit making blitzkrieg tactics more likely to work well.
                    I am however thinking of using your Idea with beefing up the Marines, but not with HP. And using Cruise missiles rather than Bombard in the subs.

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                    • #12
                      Originally posted by FrantzX
                      I think I remember Vel saying something about how the AI get evil if you make a ground unit with hidden nationality. Any comments on this?
                      I am interested to see what the AI would do with it make it A Special Forces unit or something, Maybe even give it the invisible qualities of a sub. But definitely make it expensive.

                      Comment


                      • #13
                        Intereting ideas, but the Worker movement of 2 is somewhat too strong for me. That's 6 tiles once there's a road, it should be increasing all the work speed dramatically.
                        Solver, WePlayCiv Co-Administrator
                        Contact: solver-at-weplayciv-dot-com
                        I can kill you whenever I please... but not today. - The Cigarette Smoking Man

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                        • #14
                          The point with the worker is that it basically makes it equal to the engineer in CIV 2

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                          • #15
                            Engineer in Civ 2 came pretty late, though.
                            Solver, WePlayCiv Co-Administrator
                            Contact: solver-at-weplayciv-dot-com
                            I can kill you whenever I please... but not today. - The Cigarette Smoking Man

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