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**delfino** · June 5, 2002, 05:44

I am sorry, but I have to disagree with you.

That is not, at least as I see it, a sign of cleverness. It is rather one thing that CIV3 has perfectioned: the "AI" gangbang. In CIV3 you do not have 5, 6, 10, whatever opponents; you have one opponent with many branches, that will always unite against you. Although I agree that is the way the game should be, I do not find it to be a sign of reasoning or analysis/decison path.

I really do admire the people that can beat the game at the higher levels under those surmounting adverse conditions. They are so above me.

all the best
carlos

**Akka** · June 5, 2002, 06:00

Originally posted by delfino
I am sorry, but I have to disagree with you.

That is not, at least as I see it, a sign of cleverness. It is rather one thing that CIV3 has perfectioned: the "AI" gangbang. In CIV3 you do not have 5, 6, 10, whatever opponents; you have one opponent with many branches, that will always unite against you. Although I agree that is the way the game should be, I do not find it to be a sign of reasoning or analysis/decison path.

Why it SHOULD be this way ?

**Harovan** · June 5, 2002, 06:04

reefer addict, delfino: Have you ever tried to get allies yourself? That's the best way against the AI ganging up. Yes, the AI is predictable, and yes, the AI fights very poor in two-front wars. Get allies yourself, or the AI will. Give a luxury or two for an alliance. If they don't agree, try a MPP with or without RoP, that makes the difference sometimes.

**notyoueither** · June 5, 2002, 06:05

That's not how it works at all, if the human uses diplomacy and doesn't treat the AI civs as sheep to be fleeced at will.

Argggh. X-post.

**Rust** · June 5, 2002, 07:17

Fleece away, than when your attacked, buy military alliances with all the other civs for peanuts. Than break them all half way through, while everyone around is fighting you can go on to be the last super power.

**Arrian** · June 5, 2002, 10:32

Yep, divide and conquer. Those who see the AI ganging up on the human probably do not seek allies, whereas the AI will seek allies. It will pay other AI civs to jump in on their side. But you could do the same - trust me, I've done it many times.

-Arrian

**Panag** · June 5, 2002, 11:39

Re: ai, not so dumb

Originally posted by reefer addict
ive read alot here about the ai being dumb and predictable, in my last two games ive seen the ai do alot to blow my hard worked plans.
first game.... emp. 16 civs im even in technology with the leaders of the game and 2 turns from theory of evolution. my strong neighbor to the north demands tribute, i laugh as i have the bigger military, he declares war on me as expected. next turn 8 other civs decide to join the battle. now im not so cofident about my defense so i switch to a war-time gov. i get ToE built and take my next 2 free techs, giving me electronics and time to build hoover dam. but now it hits me, i cant switch to hoover dam while in a war-time economy. no civ would even talk about peace untill the egyptians built the hoover dam.
second game.....emp. 16 civs after giving up every once of gold i could scrap up, my german civ aquired motorized transport, allowing me panzers and a chance at a much needed golden age. as soon as i get the tech i find all the other civs are now furious or atleast annoyed with me. i contact my oil supplier and now even he is mad, i give my maps and a luxory to smooth things out but sure enough, next turn the world decides to get rid of me before i can build those panzers. next 20 turns , no one would sell me any oil for any price. they had me down to 2 rifleman in my border cities ( trying to stop tanks ) before they would sell me any oil. by the time i had panzers , they were second rate junk( built just two before switching to modern)
anyways....thats two cases in the last week of the civ3 ai seeing a situation and reacting properly.
any other people surprized now and then buy the ai ?

hi ,

at last someone else who believes that the AI aint dumb , .....

BTW , do you happen to have a SAV(e) , ...........

have a nice day

**reefer addict** · June 5, 2002, 12:52

Those who see the AI ganging up on the human probably do not seek allies

i had spent all i had on getting motorized transport and at 100% tax rate , had nothing left to buy any allies.

as for the ai gangbang, its nothing new but i admired the fact that that was the first war i had in the game, and they timed it so i would be screwed.

allies can be your best friend or your worst enemy. sometimes it can save your but while others you end up in a 20 year war that you could have gotten out of earlier with your good reputation in hand but...

**Panag** · June 5, 2002, 12:55

hi ,

tip ; put the level of the AI at deity in the editor , ....

have a nice day

**Ben Williams** · June 5, 2002, 23:01

I've never seen the AI do anything smart, even when they attack first it's poorly done. I'm up to the level under diety now and all the AI units still prance around like lost children whenever we're at war. Taking over cities is easy because the AI never pumps up defence when its cities are in danger (or removes workers, even with railroads), and defending against attacks is easy because they never use bombardment effectivly and often attack with defensive units. And forget about multi-pronged attacks. I'd say your experiance is just bad luck, there's no way the AI could have planned anything nearly that smart.

-ben

**AIL** · June 6, 2002, 01:33

Quesiton for panag

Do you mean in the settings where it means standard AI-Level? What is it for? I always thought that's just to determine what is the default setting of the Difficulty when you play this Mod...

**delfino** · June 6, 2002, 03:17

Originally posted by Akka le Vil

Why it SHOULD be this way ?

Because the game should be able to resort to all means to defeat the human player! If that encompasses that all the opposing civs will unite against the human player, that is what they will do.

all the best
carlos

**delfino** · June 6, 2002, 03:22

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
reefer addict, delfino: Have you ever tried to get allies yourself? That's the best way against the AI ganging up. Yes, the AI is predictable, and yes, the AI fights very poor in two-front wars. Get allies yourself, or the AI will. Give a luxury or two for an alliance. If they don't agree, try a MPP with or without RoP, that makes the difference sometimes.

Yes tried several times. Found it of no use at all. In one game I was protecting the Germans against the Egiptians. Never touched the Germans, always respected their territory, gave them techs for free, furs and dyes. Still they broke their alliance with me and united with the Egyptians (which had been their enemies from the begining). There is no logic within the CIV3 "AI", other than the defeat of the human player. And I will say it again: that is the way it is supposed to be!!

all the best
carlos

**delfino** · June 6, 2002, 03:26

Originally posted by Ben Williams
I've never seen the AI do anything smart, even when they attack first it's poorly done. I'm up to the level under diety now and all the AI units still prance around like lost children whenever we're at war. Taking over cities is easy because the AI never pumps up defence when its cities are in danger (or removes workers, even with railroads), and defending against attacks is easy because they never use bombardment effectivly and often attack with defensive units. And forget about multi-pronged attacks. I'd say your experiance is just bad luck, there's no way the AI could have planned anything nearly that smart.

-ben

Totally agree. Dead right.

all the best
carlos

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ai, not so dumb

ai, not so dumb

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