FIRAXIS! No More Draft! Hell, No, We Won't Go!

[Moonsinger]

"No More Draft! Hell, No, We Won't Go!" What is up with that? If a city is constantly drafted or pop rushed, its citizen will be very unhappy - so far so good here. However, when that city is conquered by another civ (or by me), the unhappiness dued to those recent draft or pop rush shouldn't be transfered to the new owner.

I really hate it when I conquer a city and find out that there is nothing I could do to make those people content becuase their previous ruler treated them like dirt! I think the people should be smarter than that and realize that I am not like their previous cruel ruler. May be Firaxis could do something about this in the next patch. Thanks!

[Cyclotron]

Well, in support of the idea, unhappy people won't suddenly become happy now that they have been taken over... their loved ones are still out on the battlefield, remember?

Still, you have a valid point, and I have asked myself that same question in my games. Perhaps there would be only 50% of the effect, unless you started drafting from that city (in which case you would be slammed with the full 100% immediatly).

[ALPHA WOLF 64]

this topic AGIAN? uugghhhhhhhh

[Moonsinger]

Originally posted by ALPHA WOLF 64
this topic AGIAN? uugghhhhhhhh

Sorry, I am not aware that you guys have talked about this before.

[notyoueither]

No problem. Happens all the time. Don't let the grumps bother you.

Congrats on your game BTW.

[Soren Johnson]

Originally posted by cyclotron7
Still, you have a valid point, and I have asked myself that same question in my games. Perhaps there would be only 50% of the effect, unless you started drafting from that city (in which case you would be slammed with the full 100% immediatly).

This is, in fact, the way it works... if you capture a city, the previous effects of draft/rushing are cut in half.

[notyoueither]

What if it goes to another player? 50% cut again?

[Cyclotron]

Originally posted by Soren Johnson Firaxis This is, in fact, the way it works... if you capture a city, the previous effects of draft/rushing are cut in half.

Thanks, Soren. What part is halved? The duration or the "intensity?"

[Theseus]

Interesting... I had noted recently, when capturing cities but immediately letting them be re-captured and capturing them again (I've been experimenting with extreme aggressive expansion, and can;t defend as well as I can attack), that, not only is the smaller size (2 pop less) helpful, but that the citizens are more "manageable."

I'd be interested to hear more from Soren or someone else as to the exact machanism.

Thanks, Soren, for the input.

[Moonsinger]

Originally posted by Soren Johnson Firaxis This is, in fact, the way it works... if you capture a city, the previous effects of draft/rushing are cut in half.

Thank you for your quick response.

[FrantzX]

You know Soren, one day you are gonna hafta post all of the little things about Civ III we don't know about.

[Akka]

Unhappiness relative to draft and forced labor should be linked to a civilization.
Example : Washington has been drafted twice and lost one pop to rushing by the evil Abe. Then the Babylonians capture it, and draft another unit. Then Egypt jump on the city and pop-rush two people. Then Americans retake the city.

Here is the city "unhappiness" : 3 toward Americans, 2 toward Egyptians and 1 toward Babylonians.
Simple, logical and practical.

[HazieDaVampire]

What would be cool would be if you could prepear reserves, Draft units that don't give the anti-draft civilian effect, but they only get drafted in after somthing like a nuclear attack, or if you lose 5+ of your original citys, or your normal army gets killed off loads!
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Another idea for reserves, is you can pay to train as meny as you want, and if you ever need them you can alocate them to different areas (land, sea, air) and those units take half the time to build (cuz your only building the unit, the trainings already complete!). So, if you ever find you have a cash flow problem, but really need to research for that new weapon, you can keep your militerys size a bit lower than normal, and if a few of them die in a war, you can get your reserves into action!

[Moonsinger]

Originally posted by Akka le Vil
Example : Washington has been drafted twice and lost one pop to rushing by the evil Abe. Then the Babylonians capture it, and draft another unit. Then Egypt jump on the city and pop-rush two people. Then Americans retake the city.

Here is the city "unhappiness" : 3 toward Americans, 2 toward Egyptians and 1 toward Babylonians.
Simple, logical and practical.

It's not that simple in real life! If that really happens to you in real life, how do you feel? If the Americans treated you badly, the Egyptians treated you badly, the Babylonians treated you badly, then now the French is talking over. How do you feel about the French? Do you really think that they are your savior or do you think that they are no different than your previous evil rulers?

In real life, there is a thing called psychological and emotional damage. If you are getting hurt by humans over and over again, eventually, you will distrust all humans. It's a lot like brain washing...you will eventually hate all rulers even though the last one is your true savior.

[Akka]

Originally posted by Moonsinger


It's not that simple in real life! If that really happens to you in real life, how do you feel? If the Americans treated you badly, the Egyptians treated you badly, the Babylonians treated you badly, then now the French is talking over. How do you feel about the French? Do you really think that they are your savior or do you think that they are no different than your previous evil rulers?

In real life, there is a thing called psychological and emotional damage. If you are getting hurt by humans over and over again, eventually, you will distrust all humans. It's a lot like brain washing...you will eventually hate all rulers even though the last one is your true savior.

That's true.
But we don't need to have a psychological analysis of the damages done and the recovery time and so on. We need a simple and efficient system to SIMULATE reality.
I think that linking the unhappiness to each civ make the player to "take his responsabilities" in the fact that he's not punished just because the AI forced labored its population, and that he can't hamper the AI the same way.
And well, your example works for population that is constantly tyrannised.
Now, imagine that you are the Japaneses, you have a city with perfectly happy citizens, and China capture it, pop-rush three pop points, and you retake the city. Still, you have to cope the hatred of people toward you, while you defended the city and liberated it.

Maybe that my method is not perfect, but it still makes more sense in my opinion.