damn pollution

[MonsterMan]

My mod takes some aggressive steps to reduce the pollution aspect of the game. Download that if you're in need of a break.

[Flight]

did no one see Erin Brockovich!?

pollution is everywhere!

all sources are questionable and this is waaaaaay off topic with no solution likely to evolve.

[Dis]

I haven't seen it. But I don't think squares that represent thousands of acres should be completely shut down.

I was happy in civ2 with their reduction in production and food capacity. I can't remember the numbers but I believe it was either 50% or 75% reduction in capacity.

This was good because it didn't throw your worker off the square. You could still work polluted squares, but at a reduced capacity. This was perfectly fine, but they had to screw it up like they did the rest of the game. A$$holes.

[ACooper]

Originally posted by Dissident
they had to screw it up like they did the rest of the game. A$$holes.

Then why are you still here?

[ChrisShaffer]

Perhaps he's still here because, like me, he hopes they will fix it.

From a game play perspective, the pollution interface is broken. There's too much, and it requires too much of the player's attention (and mouse clicks) to clean up. I want to play a game, not manage an environmental disaster simulation.

[star mouse]

I have no problem with the implementation of pollution in CIV3. It is an annoyance, but so are desert squares and AI's that declare war on you for no good reason. If the game lacked such challenges, it would be no fun to play.

The only real annoyance are labourers that don't go back to work once the pollution is gone.

[Dis]

that's exactly my complaint.

It couldn't be that hard to fix. In fact this is one major reason I hate the industrial age, and even the modern age because even then I can't get rid of it.

They could fix it like in civ2. That is all I want. A 75% reduction in square capacity is plenty strong enough to urge the player to fix the pollution in a hurry.

[Skanky Burns]

Originally posted by ACooper
Sounds like realism to me.

Realism?!?

I play a game to have fun, not to do more work after a day of work.
If adding realism increases the amount of fun that I have, then I'm all for it. If realism is at best an annoyance, at worst something that will cause me to stop playing the game, then somehow I dont think that feature was well-thought-out.

With the latest patch, pollution occuring has been moved to the "annoying" catagory as my workers on pollution duty clean it automatically, and my mood managers in the city automatically re-assign population to the unused tile. Unless a small city near my super-city steals the production rights of a tile, forcing me to fix both cities.

While other things may be considered annoyances, such as deserts or enemy civs, these at least you can deal with. Deserts involve strategic tradeoffs - do I risk having a fairly pathetic city until railroads, in the hope of getting oil later, or do I place my cities only in good positions and risk not getting oil??
AIs declaring war - at least this you can control. Again, a strategic trade-off. Do I concentrate on building infrastructure and risk being another civs b****, or do I build an army larger than my neighbours at the cost of my infrastructure?? We know that a big army = enemy not declaring war on you.

But do the same thinking with pollution:
Do I avoid building factories and hospitals in the hope of reducing pollution until I have discovered recycling, many many techs away, and still get pollution, or do I build factories and hospitals, get the benefits from these buildings, and still get pollution??
Because like it or not, as soon as you get some industrial techs, pollution will occur no matter what you do. There is no choice, no challenge, no fun.

[Willem]

Originally posted by Skanky Burns

But do the same thinking with pollution:
Do I avoid building factories and hospitals in the hope of reducing pollution until I have discovered recycling, many many techs away, and still get pollution, or do I build factories and hospitals, get the benefits from these buildings, and still get pollution??
Because like it or not, as soon as you get some industrial techs, pollution will occur no matter what you do. There is no choice, no challenge, no fun.

Well if it bothers you that much, then spend a little time and create new ways of dealing with it, with the editor and/or with MultiTool. You can either lower the pollution levels of various buildings, add pollution control to others, or even create brand new structures. If that's the main thing that's bothering you about the game, it's easy enough to customize it to your liking, or even eliminate it completely.

[Dis]

Can you eliminate it completely with the editor?

I wouldn't want to do that though.

I just want it to be like civ2. Yes I know I should play civ2 then. But it's not on my hard drive anymore.

[Willem]

Originally posted by Dissident
Can you eliminate it completely with the editor?

I wouldn't want to do that though.

I just want it to be like civ2. Yes I know I should play civ2 then. But it's not on my hard drive anymore.

You can do what ever you want with it in the editor. Or like I said, you can even create a new building using MultiTool that shows up earlier. I've created a Sewer System that I can build shortly after my first Factory. I don't want to be fighting pollution either, and I certainly don't want to deal with global warming. But I don't want to eliminate it completely either. So I'll just make up my own rules until I find a comfortable balance.

The game is almost completely customizable. If there's something you don't like, chances are you can change it. And it's a lot more fun than getting frustrated about some aspect of it, like pollution.

[Skanky Burns]

Originally posted by Willem
Well if it bothers you that much, then spend a little time and create new ways of dealing with it, with the editor and/or with MultiTool. You can either lower the pollution levels of various buildings, add pollution control to others, or even create brand new structures. If that's the main thing that's bothering you about the game, it's easy enough to customize it to your liking, or even eliminate it completely.

Yeah, I probably will end up doing that, because I just don't find pollution fun. Maybe give temples the properties of the mass-transit and the recycling center.

At least with 1.17 they gave us back the ability to automate workers properly so they cleaned pollution in 1 turn and go back to sleep again.
Now all we need is to kill the domestic nag, and I won't have anything to complain about.

[Pyrodrew]

Hoo Hoo Hoo Hoo

I never have a problem with pollution in Civ3 & I am a big fan of factories in most/all cities. Factories also help with waste in a sense since if your quantity of total shields go up your good shields go up too.

Could be due to...

1.I often play an Industrious Civ. American & other Industrious Civs can clean that up VERY quick. Industrious rules.

2.The prior wars always provide me lots of slave workers, again making pollution even easier to clean up. One of the many many advantages of war. In Civ2 you at least got points at the end for being peaceful, in Civ3 you get nothing.

3.The Hoover Dam... I always get that baby. Racing for the Hoover Dam means I go down a different path than the AI which is good for tech-trading & saves me tons of $$ and TIME from building coal plants. After reading these posts I'll make sure never to forget her.

4.There are bigger things to complain about in Civ3, if you want to complain.

[Willem]

Originally posted by Skanky Burns


Yeah, I probably will end up doing that, because I just don't find pollution fun. Maybe give temples the properties of the mass-transit and the recycling center.

At least with 1.17 they gave us back the ability to automate workers properly so they cleaned pollution in 1 turn and go back to sleep again.
Now all we need is to kill the domestic nag, and I won't have anything to complain about.

May I suggest? Make a copy of the Aqueduct, then call it Sewer System, available in Sanitation. Set it to eliminate pop pollution, or both, then convert the Mass Transit to reduces building pollution. It would put some realism into it anyway, and give you an extra thing to build in the late game.