Should Firaxis now work on Patches or an XP???

[jbrians]

Editor, then XP

It would be best if they release one more patch that makes the editor truly useful. Then, while the mod community is extending the life of the original game, they could work on the XP with multiplayer support.
-Brian

[yin26]

if they had waited a year before releasing the game would you be *****ing that you wished they had released it earlier?

In fact, I felt that the October release would be a huge mistake in terms of quality of the game. Now we have another case of release a beta and patch toward a complete game.

[Rhuarc]

XP with MP!!!

I think they should be working on an XP that does a couple of things.

1. MP
2. Work on bugs (installation and that type)
3. Add features that most of the civ community thinks is needed (ex.. work on stacked movement)

Iw ould defenitly buy an XP that included these things. Overall I have really enjoyed my civ3 experience, but I think that these things would greatly inmprove the game!!

[Technoron]

I, personally, would not place priority on tricking out the stereo in a car with flat tires....

[randomturn]

Boy, I'm moving so close to Yin I can barely tell us apart anymore. I don't mean in terms of his attitude, but rather his conclusions. I played this game for 2-3 months straight when it first came out and contributed as much to the strategy section as anyone here other than Vel. Like Vel, I really want this to be a great game.

But it isn't. It's so deeply flawed that I feel let down by Firaxis. I want them to step up and do the right thing by the fans. They need to fix and complete this game regardless of what the sales numbers justify, because it's not just about this game; it's about their reputation. Once a game developer with a reputation for making solid games releases a buggy beta like this, they forever go into the list of just another game company. Black Isle Studios was so concerned about that after they released the too-short Icewind Dale: Heart of Winter that they produced a free downloadable expansion (and it rocked). There was no doublespeak to the community. They came out straight up and said "Hey, we made a mistake. Now we're making up for it." It was lickety split, no ****. As a result, I'll keep buying every BIS game first day of release.

Civ3 is pretty darn messy: there are still omissions and bugs everywhere. Just off the top of my head, it's virtually impossible for anyone who doesn't run a search of these forums to understand something as basic diplomacy and spying. The diplomatic victory is ridiculous. The game doesn't even work on my system anymore because I uninstalled it and removed all traces of it from my computer but the installation program will not let me install it again (I only get play and reinstall options, neither of which works). There are dozens more bugs and the patches just seem to be fixing little things. Then there are major complaints with combat and corruption and play balance. The wonders are unbalanced and it really annoys me there are no wonder movies. The game tends to "force" play, as I discussed on another thread a long time ago, making games all play out kind of the same, especially at the higher levels.

And most important, this game should have been released with an editor suitable to the needs of the mod community and with multiplayer. The editor is so close to being better than Civ2's, but as it is it's alomst unusable for mods. Both the editor and MP are basic and I will not pay for them. I expect them to be added for free. If they are added in an XP, I will pirate and give Civ3 another chance. Don't talk to me about stealing either, since I bought the falsely-advertised "Collector's Edition," so I've already overpaid by $15-20. If these necessary features are not created I will do what I've been doing for the last few months -- I will not play Civ3 and will not buy other Firaxis or Infogrammes games.

[CapTVK]

I think the reality that's beginning to set in is that Civ3 never will be 'perfect', or balanced for that matter. Civ3 wasn't properly playtested because some people (I'm refering to both parties!) wanted the game early instead of later (I remember the poll!). Now we're paying the price for that. Every patch seems to solve as much problems as it creates. Meanwhile the player is crammed further into a straight jacket with every patch.


My suggestion is dropping all the patch work and go straight for the expansion pack, or go straight for MP gold, in say 6-9 months. That should be enough time to properly balance this game. At least I hope so.


In the meantime I'll spend my time on other civ related endeavours. There are more civ-projects in the world than Civ3 alone.

[Panag]

Originally posted by CapTVK
I think the reality that's beginning to set in is that Civ3 never will be 'perfect', or balanced for that matter. Civ3 wasn't properly playtested because some people (I'm refering to both parties!) wanted the game early instead of later (I remember the poll!). Now we're paying the price for that. Every patch seems to solve as much problems as it creates. Meanwhile the player is crammed further into a straight jacket with every patch.


My suggestion is dropping all the patch work and go straight for the expansion pack, or go straight for MP gold, in say 6-9 months. That should be enough time to properly balance this game. At least I hope so.


In the meantime I'll spend my time on other civ related endeavours. There are more civ-projects in the world than Civ3 alone.

hi , huh , well , i am sure that there are enough people who want to alfa and beta testing , huh , even for free , ahem , now , lets brainstorm on how to make it better , hmm , .......

mp gold , allas , another 50 usd , okay , its worth it , but what are they going to do , start from zip , .................

balance , well , huh , they had time , .......another 2 years and a patch , huh , who needs a patch to patch up the patch the patch that whas meant to patch the pâtch , help , i need a patch from my doc , so i can patch up myself , .............

i need something for my stomach , a patch , ...........

maybe they could start from zero , with a good team , huh , i would look for some people on this forum , and i would built a team that is not having problems with each other , like i dont like you because you a re black or you are from europe or you are gay , bla bla , just work on the game , point .

have a nice day

[planetfall]

Randomturn
Uninstalled everything and now can't install on my system.

More precise statement would be you tried to uninstall but uninstall was incomplete. Presuming you are running windows check the following {not at system so don't know what you need to look for exactly, but these are the type of things to look for}

• a firaxis created directory with hidden or other files still in it
  
• a firaxis or civ3 *.ini file
  
• a fixaxis or civ3 entry in win.ini or system.ini file
  
• a firaxis or civ3 entry in the registry. (Careful here, backup first to floppy. Only delete firaxis or civ3 entries.). regedit.exe
  
• a firaxis or civ3 entry/files in temporary directory. (Probably C:\windows\temp. At DOS prompt, type `set` to find location of temporary directory).
  

If all else fails, a reinstall of windows will correct the problem and that should solve the problem.


topic

I think firaxis needs another patch first to solve the twin problems of tech devaluation and inadequate aircraft range. Then they need to take at least a year and work on the game play models and develop an improved game. After playing for 4 months and keeping up with the forums, it is obvious there is an enjoyment inadequacy. They need to provide a more enjoyable game for all three user types

1. No mods and no editor changes user
   
2. No mods but use editor to play scenario's user, with option of adding up to 8 generic special units. {BTW startup should allow users to select .bic file to use so we can store modeling preferences}
   
3. Full mod support, full XP.
   

[Panag]

Originally posted by planetfall
Randomturn
Uninstalled everything and now can't install on my system.

More precise statement would be you tried to uninstall but uninstall was incomplete. Presuming you are running windows check the following {not at system so don't know what you need to look for exactly, but these are the type of things to look for}

• a firaxis created directory with hidden or other files still in it
  
• a firaxis or civ3 *.ini file
  
• a fixaxis or civ3 entry in win.ini or system.ini file
  
• a firaxis or civ3 entry in the registry. (Careful here, backup first to floppy. Only delete firaxis or civ3 entries.). regedit.exe
  
• a firaxis or civ3 entry/files in temporary directory. (Probably C:\windows\temp. At DOS prompt, type `set` to find location of temporary directory).
  

If all else fails, a reinstall of windows will correct the problem and that should solve the problem.


topic

I think firaxis needs another patch first to solve the twin problems of tech devaluation and inadequate aircraft range. Then they need to take at least a year and work on the game play models and develop an improved game. After playing for 4 months and keeping up with the forums, it is obvious there is an enjoyment inadequacy. They need to provide a more enjoyable game for all three user types

1. No mods and no editor changes user
   
2. No mods but use editor to play scenario's user, with option of adding up to 8 generic special units. {BTW startup should allow users to select .bic file to use so we can store modeling preferences}
   
3. Full mod support, full XP.
   

hi ,


there is somewhere a locked file from infogrames , L-SANS or something , get rid of that and do a search , ya find more files , and , it could be due to the size of you BIN , deleteting 750meg aint nothing

as for the rest i agree , except one thing , time , if they want they can get it done in 90 working days , of course , ya need to hire some people , ..................... , huh , westwood or so , yeah that should do it


have a nice day

[Deornwulf]

Grape Juice instead of Merlot

I think the naysayers of the naysayers are missing the point. While Civ III may be playable and to some even a 'great' game, it is to the critics a bottle of grape juice when a Merlot was expected. It may be drinkable and even taste good but it is not what was expected or MARKETED.

Civ III should have represented a giant step forward in the evolution of the genre and instead, it is going to be just another computer game.

Peace

Yin - You never fail to crack me up. You should write Op-Eds for the NY Times or the Wall Street Journal....or both.

[barefootbadass]

Re: Grape Juice instead of Merlot

Originally posted by Deornwulf
I think the naysayers of the naysayers are missing the point. While Civ III may be playable and to some even a 'great' game, it is to the critics a bottle of grape juice when a Merlot was expected. It may be drinkable and even taste good but it is not what was expected or MARKETED.

Civ III should have represented a giant step forward in the evolution of the genre and instead, it is going to be just another computer game.

Civ 3 should have started at the point civ 2 was in the end, meaning having multiplayer and a robust editor to start with. It was released prematurely and frankly, since I currently don't find it that compelling(being limited practically to playing on small maps or at most standard because the game takes soooooo long really decreases my incentive to play it) I will likely not bother with an expansion. To date I have actually only played one game to completion because of that drag, and its been months since I played it seriously. Compare that to civ 2 which I would play for days on end without tiring of it(or maybe I just got tired of the genre, didn't play SMAC for very long either, although there were reasons for leaving that too).

[Inverse Icarus]

if it should happen (and i know it will) that the multiplayer patch should cost money, i'd protest outside the firaxis building until they made it so it was $50 game, not $50 for a beta and $20 for the "finalization".

... or until they gave me a free copy ...

[Adm.Naismith]

Re: Grape Juice instead of Merlot

Originally posted by Deornwulf
While Civ III may be playable and to some even a 'great' game, it is to the critics a bottle of grape juice when a Merlot was expected. It may be drinkable and even taste good but it is not what was expected or MARKETED.

Great quote! Straight to the point!

[Inverse Icarus]

yea, you really zinged firaxis good with that one.

[Coracle]

Re: Grape Juice instead of Merlot

Originally posted by Deornwulf
I think the naysayers of the naysayers are missing the point. While Civ III may be playable and to some even a 'great' game, it is to the critics a bottle of grape juice when a Merlot was expected. It may be drinkable and even taste good but it is not what was expected or MARKETED. . .

Ditto on Civ III.

What I EXPECT is for Firaxis to replace my beta effed up game disk with the finished product - not have the gall to try to sell me something else.