Have you gotten your money's worth?

[OneInTen]

And let's just imagine the "I got it for free so of COURSE I got my money for it" portion of the most favorable group...I wonder how many that is.

And what about the "I didn't pay anything but I still feel ripped off" section like yin26 and CharlesUFarley?

[yin26]

The word I used was 'disappointed.' Need to download a new video driver, maybe?

[OneInTen]

Well, if we have to categorise people's attitudes according to the exact words they use then I guess we're all in a category of our own and we can't make any conclusion other than everyone feels a bit different about the game.

I apologise for assuming we could do otherwise.

[yin26]

Yes, being correct often takes a bit more work. Sad, that.

[OneInTen]

Of course someone such as you who is alwayds correct never makes generalisations and categorisations. Thus I bow to your superior intellect.

[yin26]

I see, so this is your way to wiggle out of being wrong in this case? Sorry. Not enough smoke.

[OneInTen]

No, I'm saying I'm not wrong. All sarcasm aside, I stand by the categorisation, even if you want to nitpick the wording.

The point was that not everyone who hadn't paid for the game is in the satisfied customer category. That point, I believe, still stands.

Feel free to play word police though if you don't think you can disprove this any other way.

[yin26]

Again, good try. We have a language and a dictionary for a reason. Need a lesson on the difference between "ripped off" and "disappointed"? If you sincerely don't know the difference, I'll be glad to teach you.

[OneInTen]

Yes, dictionary ... like I said, play your word games. I've already said the intent of the statement is inarguable, even if you can nitpick the words used.

PS: Which dictionary is "ripped off" in as a word, coz it surely isn't in mine ( http://www.m-w.com )

[yin26]

Well, that explains it. You are unsure of what 'ripped off' means!

[Kat_Somm_Faen]

Hmm I really come here to listen. Though right now I have felt compelled to interfere.

For the true Civ fans, the ones that enjoy bilding an empire to rule the world through the ages- Civ III is not to par with Civ II. Even worse, it is far below the standard the previous Civs have put forward.

I am realy surprised that people that measure the value of a game by the time they spend in front of a computer. This is, simply and mildly put, a gross oversimplification.

Spare me your inane comments about weeks of gametime. Civ I and II gave me YEARS. And even more it gve me an experience of building and expanding. Advisors that were cool, movies and smooth gameplay.

And to additionally drive my point in. How much value do you get from you Windows or Linux OS? You spend much more in front of your OS. Pleeeeeeeeaaaaase. Value of game is not measured in the simple AMOUNT OF TIME. Especcialy when considering the lag issues and so on.

The true question should be: "Is Civ III a worthy sequel to Civ II ( or SMAC or Civ I ) ?"

Here it fails nd fails miserably.

Not the value. The honor of continuing the way of the original Civs. It surely fails miserably to do this in my book.

[OneInTen]

The game industry is about money not honour. You think the Firaxis folks work for a gold star on their homework or something?

[Kat_Somm_Faen]

So is the cocaine industry and the military and so on ( about money ). Stupid argument.

Also, the respect of the gamers to the previously high standards and game overall quality earned them money through blind obedience many of us have shown with buying this game.

My problem with Civ III is not the money or some market value or such. My problem is the GAME ITSELF.

Also, not medals but the appreciation of the public and the consumer is earned through having decent titles.

Apprently to gain your respect it is enough to make money on the software title.

P.S. Please post relevant replies. Or is that something that is a strange concept to you???

P.S.S Why do you have to be such a brownnose with respect to Firaxis/Infogrames???

[OneInTen]

I'm the brown nose? I'm not the one talking about the honour Firaxis have to bring us civ 3 ...

I stand by my point about money. They make the game because they aim to make money. That's the bottom line.

If you keep that in perspective, then it all becomes clear. Of course Firaxis are going to make something with as much mass market appeal as possible. Of course they're going to use Sid's name on it. Of course they're going to do pretty much everything they've done and are doing.

Doing it for the love of it is pretty rare in any industry these days, especially one as cut-throat as the gaming industry. And you know what - the only people who can afford to do things for the love of it are the ones with the money to finance their operations!

I can see why you might hate the economic system. I can see why you might hate our consumerised throw away society. But holding it against a company for doing exactly what is expected it in it's role in this system? For doing what just about every other company does? That seems rather silly to me.

Rest assured, if it was a choice between alienating a few fans and making a few extra bucks, 99% of the game companies out there would go for the money (off the top of my head, id is the only one I am confident would be willing to sacrifice financial gain to make fans happy, since they've proven this in the past).

Firaxis haven't done anything wrong here. The only mistake that's been made was the assumption by some people that Firaxis were somehow immune to the fiscal realities that other companies live by. You've said it yourself - you were blindly obedient and went out and bought the game.

The reality is that Firaxis aimed the game at the mass market, not hardcore fans. That doesn't make it a bad game per se, but it's probably going to tick off some fans who thought that the fans were special and the game was being made for them.

Sorry folks, Firaxis never had any responsibility to make a game for you, they had a responsibility to Infogrames and their shareholders to make the game that would sell the most copies for the least amount of development cost.

I'm sorry that civ 3 has been for some people such a harsh lesson in the way ideals often diverge from reality. But them's the breaks.

PS: Firaxis have respect from me of about the same level of any company that plays by the rules (that is, do things that are legal even if I don't necessarily agree with them). I might not admire them, but I certainly don't hate them. And I feel sorry for the people who work there, who have, to the best of my knowledge, worked as hard at their jobs as anyone on this board works at theirs, yet have copped insult after insult over their work.

[yin26]

Here's some more reality for ya: When the work is shoddy, expect some insults.