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  • #16
    MPP's tend to have strange effects.
    In one game I was at war with the Aztecs. During the upkeep fase they sign a MPP with the English (I think), the English declare war on me whereupon the Aztecs make peace with me.

    Robert
    A strategy guide? Yeah, it's what used to be called the manual.

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    • #17
      Good answer JC, thanks.
      Long time member @ Apolyton
      Civilization player since the dawn of time

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      • #18
        I had a game where I was the most powerfull nation, and all the others were making MPPs right and left to protect against me, to the point that they were all involved in the web.

        So what to do? I made friends with one of them and made him declare war on another of them. Then I sat back and watched cascating MPPs result in a huge war, and how they used all their ressources to combat each other . (I was able to stay out of most of the fighting myself, staying in democracy and without mobilization )
        http://www.hardware-wiki.com - A wiki about computers, with focus on Linux support.

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        • #19
          MPP weirdness

          It does seem like MPPs work in strange ways. My most memorable (and infuriating) example: At the end of my turn, I am at peace with both India and England. Then, during their turn, India declares war on me. And immediately, England declares war on me too, because "they had a mutual protection pact". There was no Indian aggression towards me in between. And I know I didn't do anything, since it was between turns for me.

          I am utterly unable to figure out the set of rules to make this happen. Or could it be that England just felt like declaring war anyway, and my advisor is jumping to conclusions regarding the causes?

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          • #20
            Thue brings up a key element to counteract the MPPs against you. You can still get alliances for war against somebody else, dragging all of their friends into the fray. With the right situation, you can sit and watch while the AIs butt heads. Or hover nearby to mop up once the bodies are piling up.
            The first President of the first Apolyton Democracy Game (CivII, that is)

            The gift of speech is given to many,
            intelligence to few.

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            • #21
              The AI civilizations are perfectly capable of joining a war voluntarily, without any outside prodding. They're especially likely to do this when a favored ally is fighting a hated enemy, and MPPs definitely seem to give a massive relations boost (they seem to be one of the only ways I can manage to get an AI civilization to become Gracious).

              I usually play to avoid wiping out any civs, ever, so usually I'll try to cut a weaker civ to shreds and then zealously guard their sovereignty to prevent any other civilizations from wiping them out, which can sometimes involve MPPs post-nationalism. Not always, because I'm just trying to protect them if another nation threatens them... I don't want to drag them into my own wars with major world powers. But I find that usually they'll eventually join in any major war I get into anyways, because they're just good allies even if they have no formal obligation to fight. I've had this happen a few times with civs that just happened to be Gracious without any MPPs or alliances (part of my effort to keep all civs on the map includes giving key tech and resources to downtrodden nations if necessary, although it still seems to take a LOT to get them up to Gracious).

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              • #22
                The AI also seems to join into an existing war if it can see 1 side is seriously outmatched and so can expect to gain by picking the winning side
                "An Outside Context Problem was the sort of thing most civilisations encountered just once, and which they tended to encounter rather in the same way a sentence encountered a full stop" - Excession

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                • #23
                  I had a doozy in an early 16-way Huge game. Persians, and I'm in first place (barely) thanks to a lucky geographical distribution and an early wipeout of the Babylonians (complete with a leader to build the FP).

                  I've just reached Chivalry, but I can't make any Knights, because I don't have horses. I need horses. I'm between the Greeks (5 horses) and the Egyptians (2), and the Egyptians have been giving me trouble. I try invading with Immortals, no luck. So, I go back and spend all my treasury and a tech to:
                  1> Buy horses from the Greeks for 20 turns
                  2> Build as many Knights in those 20 as I can
                  3> Pay Greece and Rome to fight Egypt with me, and pay America to fight Russia, China to fight Japan, and the Aztec to fight the Iriquois (hey, a world war keeps them off my back)
                  4> Make a right-of-passage agreement with Rome and Greece

                  I invade Egypt, grab a few cities and one horse, and sue for peace. Greece and Rome continue sending troops through my territory (and Egypt can't stop them without stepping on my land), and pretty much wipe out the Egyptian counterattack while I make more Knights. Then I finish wiping out the Egyptians, attacking through the new Roman and Greek lands.
                  When it's all over, I've got a triple-sized empire, two loyal allies, and the rest of the world has beaten itself up. With MPPs this would have been MUCH easier.

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