Too many people cheating in Civ III?

[yavoon]

fine ralf, I've give u example from SMAC. just the opening settings of smac can have a huge difference on how good the ai is. but wait, if I'm changing the settings doesn't that effect everyone?

if u give everyone a starting former in smac, that helps the ai a ton, and certainly a lot more than you. but wait, I gave everyone a former.

if u eliminate clean units in smac that again helps the ai a ton in relation to you, but wait, we made another universal change.

funny how this crap works, u can make global changes that have drastic effects on the power of the ai.

sometimes I'm shocked how naive ppl can be.

[Pyrodrew]

N.C.:We must join together to protect helpless AIs from the evil Johnnie Nogoods of this world.

By wrong, I meant not fair. If you read my post whether cheating is wrong was NOT the point of my post, which you obviously missed.

[n.c.]

Originally posted by Pyrodrew
By wrong, I meant not fair.

Um, so what? My comentary still applies, your feeling foolish notwithstanding.

[Ralf]

Originally posted by yavoon
funny how this crap works, u can make global changes that have drastic effects on the power of the ai.

Well, obviously - thats the whole point. Why bother with messing around with these inputs if it doesnt effect the power of the AI-civs? Thats goes without saying, dont you think?

sometimes I'm shocked how naive ppl can be.

Its not a question of being naive, Yavoon. Its a question of not to patronize people, just because they want to make use a Firaxis-provided game-editor every know and then, in order to fine-tweak games-rules back and forth. Also, dont underestimate the intelligens of the scenario-, modpack- and rule-tweaking Civ-veteran community out there. Dont you think these guys are capable of deciding for themselves exactly how much can be altered, without everything gets out of hand? Its a question of trial and error. And in those cases it DOES get out of hand - what business is it of yours?

[yavoon]

I feel perfectly fine in givnig my opinion to them. I assure you that my opinion in no way inhibits their ability to make the game senselessly easy and uncomplicated. and I fully endorse their right, after legal purchase of civ3 to make any/all changes they at netime find neccessary.

THAT being sed, they're a buncha editor changing newbies.

[Pyrodrew]

Originally posted by n.c.
Um, so what? My comentary still applies, your feeling foolish notwithstanding.

Umm... no it doesn't since I don't care whether people want to play an unfair game or not. The focus of my post was on what was considered cheating which you overlooked. But thanks for playing.

[n.c.]

Originally posted by Pyrodrew
what was considered cheating

What I found amusing is the nonesense that ANYTHING can be considered "cheating" in SP.

[Delbert]

My thought.

Live and let live, if someone else want's to play by different rules then let em.

As long as they don't try to come into my game and change the rules on my civIII.

as a hardcore civer, i'll just keep the default rules.

Delbert

[Pyrodrew]

Originally posted by n.c.
What I found amusing is the nonesense that ANYTHING can be considered "cheating" in SP.

What I find amusing is you need to look up the word cheating.

[n.c.]

Originally posted by Pyrodrew
What I find amusing is you need to look up the word cheating.

I suppose that would be funny where it happens (which it did not in this case). However, even still it would not compare to the comedic value of someone old enough to use a computer petulantly describing rule alterations with words like "wrong" "unfair" and "cheating."

In other words grow up and get some perspective or get used to people laughing at you.

[Pyrodrew]

Originally posted by n.c.
I suppose that would be funny where it happens (which it did not in this case). However, even still it would not compare to the comedic value of someone old enough to use a computer petulantly describing rule alterations with words like "wrong" "unfair" and "cheating."

In other words grow up and get some perspective or get used to people laughing at you.

Your zeal has made you lose your perspective. I merely clarified what cheating was & then you went off on a tangent of "protecting the AI". I tried to clear up that situation, but it seems you're just looking for something to complain about. And as I said earlier rule alterations which affect all the players in the game is not "cheating" or "unfair" or "wrong"... that was my point. Re-read my post.

You might want to rethink your next post so those people aren't laughing at you... if you could grow up.

[n.c.]

Originally posted by Pyrodrew
I merely clarified what cheating was & then you went off on a tangent of "protecting the AI".

Your "clarification" came after my "tangent." Please.

-"you're just looking for something to complain about."
I am looking to complain? It is the whining of folks like you that I parodied.

I'll be out for awhile but I look forward to your next attempt.

[Rhysie]

I agree that people are using the editor to remove challenges or parts of the game that they find too difficult, and I feel that this cheapens any achievements they might make. It also makes it much harder to compare people...

I also believe I know why these people resort to this... It is because they are so paranoid about people thinking they are not 'hardcore' because they don't play on the higher levels that they refuse to just accept that civ 3 is going to be harder than civ 2 and if they want to do as well as they did in civ 2 they are going to have to take the difficulty level down a peg or two. But instead, their paranoia drives them to alter the game and remove the challenges so that they are not suffered the dishonour of playing a level below regent.

[Pyrodrew]

Originally posted by n.c.
Your "clarification" came after my "tangent." Please.

-"you're just looking for something to complain about."
I am looking to complain? It is the whining of folks like you that I parodied.

Again, re-read my post there was no complaint there. It was merely clearing up the misconception that rule alterations is not cheating (which you agreed on!). Thus like a poor marksman you've missed your target. Yet, you still continue with your pety futile flames. Advice - don't take people's sentences out of context & twist them for an argument, read their entire post before jumping to conclusions.

I'll be out for awhile but I look forward to your next attempt.

"Look forward to my next" - exactly you don't really have anything against what I said you're just looking for a fight.

[adaMada]

um... what's the issue, here?

wow, so much agression... for crying out loud people, this just can't matter that much...

having said that, i think there are two issues here that are causing all of this pain, suffering, and misery. FIrst, you have the question over if using the editor is right/moral/whatever. To be honest, I see this as a non-issue. If people think that'll enhance their gameplay 'experience', then that's just fine. Personally, I don't plan to change much (except while playing scns), but hey, that's because I can't beat the game as it is ! As for inaccurate ratings, as long as people say that they've edited the rules, it's just really not worth the misery... those people will just have to either not compare themselves to others or acknowledge the rule changes and how that affects it all... in all honesty, I don't see why people are so upset over this.

The second issue is the tendency of people to say "Who cares, you can change it in the editor..." Again, I think this is more or less a non-issue. As long as Faraxis provides patches and fixes issues for those of us who DON'T want to use the editor, everyone's happy. And Faraxis can't really say "edit it yourself", can they? Again, I just don't see an issue worth debating here...

In other words, I'm kind of confused as to why everyone seems to care so much ... well, just by two cents.

-- adaMada