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**Leonidas** · October 31, 2001, 15:03

Yup

The core game is playable and enjoyable - but think what might have been. . .

**Ozymandous** · October 31, 2001, 15:57

Re: They Released It Too Early

Originally posted by rockville

1. No wonder movies
I posted an earlier thread on "Short Wonder Movies" based on the avault review. The truth is that they are static shots with a change in lighting. Totally look like placeholders. Might as well have said "Insert Video Here When Ready"

2. Lame intro movie
Just not good enough to be part of a polished experience. I know, how many times have I bought a game with the exact opposite, cool intro lousy gameplay, but that still doesn't let Firaxis off the hook.

3. Editor
I don't know much about this, but look at other threads for limitations about the editor

4. Interface issues
How many moves does a unit have left? Damn if I know. Is that a settler, a worker, or a spearman? Can't tell without clicking. What's in my build queue? Have to click to see.
Interface issues bug me more than anything. It's why I had to return CTP2. Civ3 does a pretty good job of this, but it still feels 90% done.

5. Two levels of zoom
You can soom out, and then you can zoom back in. That seems to be about it, but maybe I've missed something.

1. They said months ago there would be NO wonder movies because there wasn't a need to put that much production into something 99% of the people would turn off after seeing it a few times.

2. See reason for number 1 except they didn't say it, I did, why waste resources on something you'll watch maybe three times before hitting "enter" or "Esc" to by-pass and get on with the game?

3. They have said they will upgrade the editor as well. The game was essentially done and they didn't feel it fair to deny people the ability to at least get a feel for and enjoy the game just because the editor wasn't completely how they wanted it yet.

4. Sound like valid concerns but clicking on the unit gives all this information you seek, the same as in Civ1 & Civ 2.

5. Yep, another level of zoom would have been nice but would you rather they had worked on even more graphics or the core AI and interface?

Yep, you're right, the post was a gripe about all the things *you* didn't like that were different than Civ2. Play it for another 40 hours and say how bad it still is, or take it back if the game bothers you that much.

**Steve Clark** · October 31, 2001, 16:03

"They" should be Infogrames, not Firaxis. It was Infogrames that set the release date and distributed the game. Firaxis did what it had to do in order to meet the early deadline to get it to the manufacturer.

**Dis** · October 31, 2001, 16:13

I still say they made a big mistake with wonder movies.

Think of it this way. Even though us hardcore civ guys turn it off, they already know most of us will buy the game either way.

But they are missing out on potential sales from the general public. You might have an average guy only play the game modestly but be impressed enough with the wonder movies to make it look like a fantastic game. He then recommends the game to other who buy it.

I still think the movies could have paid for themselves and then some.

I really enjoyed the wonder movies the first time I played civ2. Yes I eventually started playing without the cd so I didn't have the option. Or I just hit the space bar. But I watched them quite a number of times (esp. the hoover dam, since it is near where I live, and I like the looks of it). Makes building a wonder that much more satisfying.

**Comrade Tribune** · October 31, 2001, 16:22

Re: They Released It Too Early

[SIZE=1] All I'm saying is that, if I could sum up my early thoughts about this game, I think one thing: "rushed".

That was my first thought immediately after I read the -superficially enthusiastic- reviews, but when I said something like there is probably an anthill full of small but significant problems, Imran came over, hit me on my head with a brick and said I was trolling...

To be fair, I have also read a number of good things about the AI that seem plausible enough, so I believe the game will not be another CtPII, just a mixed blessing...

**Imran Siddiqui** · October 31, 2001, 16:32

Well, if you aren't trolling then you are making a mountain out of a molehill. Very small problems I've seen to date.

It seems like people thought the game would be perfect

.

**Faboba** · October 31, 2001, 16:42

Re: Re: They Released It Too Early

Originally posted by Comrade Tribune

Imran came over, hit me on my head with a brick and said I was trolling...

Imran doesn't seem to be like most people mentally. Maybe you were trolling but didn't notice it yet he was able to pick up on it.

Back on track - I take your point that these are all niggling annpyances, but none of these are major nor should they majoryl impact the enjoyment of the game with what sounds like vastly improved AI and graphics over it's predecesor.

As for your 4th point, it'll grow on you. Things take time. Though how you expect to get information without ever clicking your mouse is beyond me

Sounds like a whole new level of laziness.

**Comrade Tribune** · October 31, 2001, 18:37

Re: Re: Re: They Released It Too Early

Originally posted by Faboba
As for your 4th point, it'll grow on you. Things take time. Though how you expect to get information without ever clicking your mouse is beyond me

Sounds like a whole new level of laziness.

You are lazy yourself; otherwise you wouldn´t mistake me for Rockwell.

I was referring to another thread.

**yin26** · October 31, 2001, 19:18

Civ3's OPEN BETA has begun!

Step 1: Merely purchase the Civ3 Beta online or at many stores near you for approximately $50.

Step 2: Test the game for us. If you can, please fix the MP code, the missing editor features, sloppy graphics coding, etc. We saw this was possible with the CtP code ... and we hope to live up to the CtP standard.

Step 3: Pay an additional $35 for the "real" Civ 3, which will be called an 'X-Pack,' which is just hip FIRAXIS talk for "Passable Product." Don't worry: The fools who didn't already join the Beta Program won't have the previous version so they can't install the X-Pack! They'll have to wait MONTHS to get the game that way! LOL! Hey, you're a beta tester ... you deserve a bone.

Step 4: In the future, rush to buy anything we throw out the door, no matter how obviously rushed the game is or no matter how we will undoubtedly lie to your face and purposely keep you misinformed so we can rip a few more dollars from you. And if people say any of the bugs are our fault, you will be required to say: "Hey, INFOGRAMES made all the decisions!" Because, as we know, Sid is God.

Thanks, and welcome to the team:

FIRAXIS!

**Case** · October 31, 2001, 19:27

so true.

**Admiral PJ** · October 31, 2001, 19:27

They will release a patch to fix any small bugs .. the things you mention are very trivial, and in no way affect the game.
I get bored of the movies , after a few times they get repetitive.
Sure they could have spent months more on the interface but it wouldn't be worth the wait.

Civ3 will be well worth the money , and I can't wait to get my hands on it

admiral Peter

**Comrade Tribune** · October 31, 2001, 19:39

Glad you kept your humour, Yin!

Always refreshing to read your posts; but be sure not to make too many critical remarks, otherwise you will be accused of 'trolling'!

**TCO** · October 31, 2001, 19:55

Originally posted by Dissident
I still say they made a big mistake with wonder movies.

Think of it this way. Even though us hardcore civ guys turn it off, they already know most of us will buy the game either way.

But they are missing out on potential sales from the general public. You might have an average guy only play the game modestly but be impressed enough with the wonder movies to make it look like a fantastic game. He then recommends the game to other who buy it.

I still think the movies could have paid for themselves and then some.

I really enjoyed the wonder movies the first time I played civ2. Yes I eventually started playing without the cd so I didn't have the option. Or I just hit the space bar. But I watched them quite a number of times (esp. the hoover dam, since it is near where I live, and I like the looks of it). Makes building a wonder that much more satisfying.

I agree. Wonder movies really drew me into Civ2 as a newbie to computer games and to civ.

**yin26** · October 31, 2001, 20:07

CT:

Yes, I think even if I were to post something *good* about Civ3, a number of people here would say I am trolling.

Keep up the fight!

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