Please do NOT pirate Civ3!

[Asmodean]

I for one would like to know, what it is that makes you guys have doubts over Civ3. Is it the missing MP - is it the lack of seriously improved graphics - what?

Off course I'll buy the game. As I have done with all other games I have wanted - ever!!!

Piracy is illegal, and should be condemned.

Asmodean

[redstar1]

Of course stealing is illegal, noone is disputing that. And if the police arrive at my door I'll hold my hands up to it. However, software piracy will NOT go away. A good deal can be done to reduce its impact. Gamers need to be able to trust not the developers, but the publishers. Developers don't want to release a game thats half tested and full of bugs. They are professionals who take pride in their work and who don't want to finish a game, have a big release party then spend the next 12 months finishing it. I have been around the warez community for a number of years and I think I can safely say that the vast majority of people use warez as a means of trying out software to see if they want to purchase it. Yes a few people make money out of it but if people buy the latest release from a market stall on a sunday afternoon well then thats their stupidity and their problem.

Imagine if you will buying a portable radio. You want to listen to the football results on a saturday afternoon. The radio works perfectly, except for the little red on light, which doesn't work properly. Not a big deal. It doesn't affect the functionality of the radio, but you take it back anyway. Now remember the last time you bought a game only to find that a part of it is not finished. You can take it back but you can't get a replacement. You have to wait for a patch. Not everyone has the internet, nor not everyone on a 56k modem is prepared to download a 5mb+ patch. Nor should we have to wait 2 months to see it on the front cover cd of a £5 magazine that failed to mention the bugs in the first place.

No, I don't trust games publishers. I don't trust what it says on the box. I want to play games before I buy them. No disrespect to the developers who do a damn good job under tight deadlines and I know that piracy affects you as well. As long as games are released half-arsed, piracy will remain a large problem.

Dave

[Asmodean]

Originally posted by redstar1
As long as games are released half-arsed, piracy will remain a large problem.

That is still no excuse for breaking the law. the law is the law, and that's that. Just because a man is an arsehole, dosn't make stealing from him any more right, than from any other man.

And anyone who can't understand that, should take a good look at themselves, before saying that they are honest, law-abiding people.

Asmodean

[redstar1]

When did I say I, or anyone else who pirates software was a law-abiding citizen. What I said referred to the source of a lot of piracy, the reason for it and a possible solution to it.

Didn't call anyone an arsehole either.

The law is the law indeed.

I don't know you, but I'm willing to hedge my bets that you've broken a law in your lifetime. Perhaps even have a piece of copyrighted material on your PC *shock horror*. Bet you have a background image for windows yeah? Do you own copyrights of the image? Thought not. If I'm wrong my apologies, but your high and mighty attitude doesn't change a thing.

I'd actually be very interested to hear Firaxis' views on the subject of piracy, and what the indiustry is doing about it. I have it from reasonably good sources that some pblishers 'leak' games to the warez community. Its a fantastic and free was of getting some heavy testing done.

Dave

[Executor]

How many of the people here actually bought their copy of Windows or Office? Just wondering.

[Provost Harrison]

Originally posted by Asmodean


That is still no excuse for breaking the law. the law is the law, and that's that. Just because a man is an arsehole, dosn't make stealing from him any more right, than from any other man.

And anyone who can't understand that, should take a good look at themselves, before saying that they are honest, law-abiding people.

Asmodean

Hmmm, we are all perfectly aware it happens. But seriously, and this comes back to the post above by Executor. I could not afford to buy Office or Windows at the cost of them, especially the full versions I would require for when I built my computer. I bet you most people do it, copy it from work and the like. Perhaps this is why microsoft charge so much for these things because businesses still pay for it. But the kind of money to pay for these is beyond my means. I need some of these things for my computer to work (ie windows) but I am not willing to pay the price. It is all very easy to be sanctimonious at times, but in reality, it is easier said than done. Microsoft has worked it's way around the problem by making it's money from businesses. The only way the public ever have these programs is if bundled with the computer or acquired from work.

I am willing to buy where feasible, eg, computer games are relatively cheap to buy and don't begrudge the money for how little I buy them.

Remember Ashmodean, sometimes laws were not always put there for the wellbeing of everyone but to allow traps for the rich to get richer.

[Solver]

In most cases, I agree with Yin. Civ 3 will be a great game, and it's surely worht to pay to Firaxis, in hope for seeing future games/xpacks. I also agree with all the reasons stated by Yin, but there's another. And this is why I will *first* get a pirate copy - a normal one later.

They request resolution is 1024x768. I want it 800x600. I will get a pirate disk, and see if it installs/runs on my machine. If yes, I get the normal one. If not , no Civ 3.

[Nikolai]

I agree with you, yin! Pirating is not good! But abadonware, on the other hand...

Yes, I know someone wont agree with me there, but abadonware that is very old, is not for sale, and then I think it is OK...!!!

[Grumbold]

The UK has a very liberal software returns policy, now supported by some companies who go further and allow a 10 day no questions asked grace period. With that in place I have never felt any need to pirate any software. However if I lived elsewhere then I almost certainly would use piracy as one possible means to evaluate games since I return about 1 in 4 purchases. The people who publish the best games also churn out some utter rubbish at times. They do not deserve to profit from them at the customers expense.

[yin26]

Hmmm. I haven't lived in the States for 5 years. How are the return policies on software? I used to LOVE Electronic Boutique for their solid return policy. And I didn't just keep the games, either, on my HD. If they sucked, I exchanged them...as it should be.

Now I'm stuck overseas and can't return stuff. I miss those great days of no questions asked returns...

[Gramphos]

Re: Please do NOT pirate Civ3!

Originally posted by yin26

• There is no demo, so how can I test the game?: You don't. You rely on some trusted people to tell you what's up. Surely there are a few people you can trust. If not, write off this game and the people who don't release a demo.

If you know someone that have bought the game you can sneak into his house and ask if you just can play a few turns.
He says: "No, I've paid for this game. I'll play all my spare time."
-But you have to eat sometime.
-Okay, you can play for half an hour when I eat.
-Thank you!
You start to play and when that half-hour is over you run to the nearest retailer of Civ3 and buys your own copy.
Or you can simply buy the game without playing it first because it will be so good, but you must NOT pirate it.

[monkspider]

I agree with you wholeheartedly Yin, well put.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Asmodean
That is still no excuse for breaking the law. the law is the law, and that's that.

Laws are not the same as justice or fairness. Often people need to fight against these tyrannical laws to get them changed.

Locally the laws covering consumer protection are totally inadequate. I can't return an item even if it doesn't work as advertised - not mandated by the law, anyway.

A lot of crap is happening, I am not going to sit down and take it.

[monkspider]

Although urban ranger makes a good point, many great revolutionaries such as Martin Luthor King were technically breaking the law. I don't see what the big deal is, it's only $40.00. I have had lunches that cost more than this. Civ III is something that you will never forget. Just buy it for pete's sake, rather than have some buggy, sound-missing, pirated version. If you feel deeply enough about civ to actually be posting at a Civ related forum (much less, reach Emperor status, Mr. ranger ) then I'm sure spending $40.00 on such a long awaited sequel should be a no-brainer.

[Ozymandous]

Originally posted by yin26
Hmmm. I haven't lived in the States for 5 years. How are the return policies on software? I used to LOVE Electronic Boutique for their solid return policy. And I didn't just keep the games, either, on my HD. If they sucked, I exchanged them...as it should be.

Now I'm stuck overseas and can't return stuff. I miss those great days of no questions asked returns...

EB still has a great return policy, which I used to return Tropico, Red Alert 2, Soldier of FOrtune and some other games that didn't like up to the hype.

I am not sure but EBWorld should also have a good policy on this, although the customer may have to pay shipping & handling.

Luckily I work about 3 miles from an EB and there is another on my way home so I always purchase my games there. I'll return any game that is buggy or fails to provide anything it promised be it Civ3, Moo3, Pools of Radiance, Soldier of Fortune2, etc.