Wonders in Civ3

[tniem]

Originally posted by Eli
So if we take a 5000 km long cord and put it in one line across lets say, the US, it will be seen from space?

Thanks Eli, I didn't want to have to say it.


Eagle one, nice thought. I am pretty sure something like this made the List of suggestions. In a way though, you already do this by sending caravans to cities building a wonder. It is essential if you want to build wonders of importance in Deity level games.

[korn469]

tniem

i have also heard that you can see the great wall from space, since not only is it long it is wide also...i'm fairly sure i saw pictures on the history channel of the great wall from space (right out of the shuttle window)

but besides that have caravans and frieght been confirmed in civ3? we know that setting up trade routes with them are out...so has firaxis said anywhere that they haven't completely gotten rid of them?

i am assuming they are in for wonder building...but we never can tell since they overhauled trade so much

[SerapisIV]

Hey if the astronauts say they can see the Great Wall, I'll believe them.

[tniem]

Let me just say that I decided to do a little research on this issue just to see if I was just blowing hot air. Anyways, first of all lets clarify 'see'.

I meant it as the unaided naked eye. If you mean taking pictures with satallites or something, yes of course you can see the wall. Heck, you could get a picture of someone's license plate on a Jeep if the latest tech is up in space.

For the unaided human eye, I thought that this quote from austronaut Alan Bean that was quoted in Tom Burnam's 1980 book 'More Misinformation,' which had a few pages devoted to debunking seeing the Great Wall in space was appropriate.

"The only thing you can see from the moon is a beautiful sphere, mostly white (clouds), some blue (ocean), patches of yellow (deserts), and every once in a while some green vegetation. No man-made object is visible on this scale. In fact, when first leaving earth's orbit and only a few thousand miles away, no man-made object is visible at that point either."

I will rest my case on that...

[SerapisIV]

The space shuttle doesn't leave earth's orbit.

Gravity on earth is 9.8 m/s2. Do you know what is on the shuttle where everyone is weightless? 9.0 m/s2 (or thereabouts). The shuttle orbits the earth at about 17,000 miles per hour, that's why everythings weightless, it's rotational speed balances gravity. If the shuttle were to stop orbiting, it would pull a Mir and do a swan dive back onto earth

[Bubba]

But tniem your quote proves too little -- all it says is that the great wall cannot be seen from the moon. Their is much "space" between the earth and the moon. Not a very strong point on which to rest one's case.

[tniem]

Instead of asking you to reread the quote, I will just quote the last sentence which you apparently missed.

In fact, when first leaving earth's orbit and only a few thousand miles away, no man-made object is visible at that point either.

[Kestrel]

Can't large conglomerations of Street Lighting (and therefore Cities) be see from Space when the surface of the Earth is in "night" (and when it is not cloudy, of course) ?

See also http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2_092

"Any number of man-made structures can be seen from space, provided we construe "structure" to mean "anything built." Many of these are things that look like long, straight lines when seen from afar, such as highways, railroads, canals, and of course walls. If the orbit is low enough you can see even more. "

The trivial Pursuit game incorrectly suggests in one of its questions (in one of its editions) that "the only man-made structure on earth visible from outer space was the Great Wall of China" yet further spreading the misinformation.

I guess it also depends on what is meant by space

What can be seen by astronauts, with their naked eyes, in orbit around the Earth (185 to 643 kilometers, or 115 to 400 statute miles) is vastly different to what can be seen with the naked eye from the moon's surface, a quarter of a million miles away.

Perhaps it is only true that they can see the Great Wall if the Astronauts have been eating "Carrots" aka the RAAF pilots from WW2

(When trying to hide the fact that new-fangled RADAR was partly responsible for the higher than expected kill-rates of the RAAF, and in an attempt to hide it from the enemy, the British Government spread the story to the public that Carrots were regularly eaten by the pilots, which improved their night vision.)

[Beckdawg]

i think you guys are missing a large point. THIS IS A GAME! If you can see cities in the game then why not the hanging gardens? Even the smalleste city 100,000 people in civ 2 could be seen.So, i think seeing these thing would be a nice thing. maybe they could be in a square of the city and add luxury or science or something plus their normal effect. like the piramids could add arrows to that square it is in. That would be neat i think. but that is just me

[Alex 14]

It is a known fact that the Great Wall is the only man made structure that can be seen from space.

[Fidel]

not much...

http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/radar/sircxsar/sc-gwall.gif

[Kestrel]

Alex14 - "It is a known fact that the Great Wall is the only man made structure that can be seen from space."

Spare me from the world of "known facts" as opposed to actual truths.

"It is a known fact that man cannot survive speeds of more than 20 m.p.h"

"It is a known fact that there will never be a need for more than 5 computers in the world "
etc. etc. etc. ... ad nausem

Do an 'Aristotle' and have a look in the horse's mouth.

[dexter4dxm]

anyone have TOT? it would be dumb to have wonders shown on the spinning globe (which would be similar to all this space talk), but i dont see any reason why the wonders cant be visible on the main map, as long as they are not covering too much up. if they actually drew them good, the wonders could really spice up the game

[Provost Harrison]

Yes, I remember seeing some things on the screen shots. One of the screenshots from a video was of the Apollo Program, so that is obviously in the game in some form or other. Another thing I saw on a city view screenshot is the Pentagon. I wonder what this does...

And tniem, I have seen pictures of China from space and you can see the Great Wall. Not from the moon mind you. But from that distance, you would have difficulty making out even large islands like Madagascar or Sumatra.

Can you see cloud patterns on Jupiter? No. It depends on the distance. From a reasonably low orbit, you can see the Great Wall for space. But this is digressing.

It probably wouldn't be necessary for the pyramids to appear on the map because they aren't *that* big and wouldn't actually perform a function physically, eg, the great canal would allow shipping across some stretch of land, or the great wall would stop invaders.

[Martinus]

Originally posted by Eli
So if we take a 5000 km long cord and put it in one line across lets say, the US, it will be seen from space?

You have probably forgotten about width, haven't you?

Of the three dimensions, height is probably the least important, don't you think?