"we cannot forget the cruel oppression you bore down on us"

[artreus]

Hello,

I am playing a emperor game with Egypt,
Civ3 Dyp 1.01r
and I stayed in monarchy becus I had no need for research (GL),
every few turn (whenever the cost was one or two lives)
i would hurry improvements in my cities ...
suddenly one of my cities turned 100 % unhappy with explanation :
"we cannot forget the cruel oppression you bore down on us"
in the mean time the GL expired and I changed to democracy, and many turns have passed since last hurry(at least 10 possibly almost 20); and that one cities has starved to size one, and is still 100% unhappy.
i have in this city a shrine; temple, theatre basilica and bazaar (with 4 luxuries) ...
does anyone know how to save this city from ethernal unhappiness ?
or should i go back in history and hurry a little bit less ?


greetings,


Artreus

[Solomwi]

Poprushing is powerful, but beware of overusing it. Someone else can explain it in better detail, but I believe you get one citizen unhappy (before modifiers like luxuries) for 20 turns each time you use it.

[vmxa1]

You don't say what size the city is, but you need to get the number of unhappy citizens offset by happy ones.

So if it is size 12 and you have 6 unhappy pops, you need 6 happy ones. If the lux and structures is not enough, then you must either up the slider or more likely set a number of citizens to entertainers, until you have equalibrium.

[Antrine]

Well, let's see, pop rush every few turns and strave em down to size one. Well with this treatment you obviously do not require any enemies, they have you! Wait it out and be good or abandon the cities one by one and restart up one by one. Either way the short run is not good.

[vondrack]

Originally posted by Antrine
Wait it out and be good or abandon the cities one by one and restart up one by one. Either way the short run is not good.

Actually, abandoning the city or cities is not going to help - when one abandons a city that is still unhappy because of past poprushing, the poprushing-induced unhappiness carries over to your other cities. I had this happen in a PBEM of mine... ugly it was, to say the least.

You have to wait it out.

[Antrine]

gee, doesn't look any good...

[artreus]

hiya,

Current size of city is 1,
it was 5 or 6 before last hurry,
so 3 or for at the beginning of unrest ...

had to switched all 3 farmes to entertainers to keep rioting down

idd very powerfull tool,
especially for cities near floodlands, popgrow every 1-2 turns,

if city will turn back to normal it was all worth it ....
i will sit a few more turns out ...

[Dry]

Originally posted by artreus
i will sit a few more turns out ...

Beware that it can be more than just a few turns. Depends on how you killed them.
Each sacrificed pop generates an unhappyness for 20 turns.
If you sacrificed 3 guys in one rush, you have generated 3 unhappy for turn 1-20, 2 for turn 21-40, and 1 for turn 41-60.
If you sacrificed 3 guys, one by one in 3 different rushes, it may last less than that.
Say you pop rush 1 guy in turn 0, 10 and 20, you have
1 unhappy for turn 1-10; 2 for turn 11-30; 1 for turn 31-40.
When pop-rushing, try to limit them to 1 citizen. If once, you pop-rush a building with 2+ citizens, avoid to pop-rush the next one. Let them cool down a bit.

I remember having captured a ennemy city where the AI had pop-rushed/draft the poor citizens like hell. I had to drop the pop to 1 (like you did) and until the end of the game this city NEVER came back. This was late in the game - industrial age -, the city had all happyness improvements, 6-7 lux with marketplace (12-16 happy faces) and Bach.

[binyo66]

I just learnt the power of pop rushing in the last couple days. I never get problem with poprushing (no city disorder) after I got 3 luxs. So, in my current game, monarch, japan, huge, continent, 16civs, I am still pop rushing (still despotism, I am about to enter modern time, and the first civ to go there). Currently I have 7 luxs (4 of them import from other contingent), and I am still planning in despotism until I could save at least 10000g (currently 4000gold). And for note, I have been in war for centuries (trying to take over my continent)
1. The good thing with pop-rush, once the capture city become content, just poprush until the size is 1. For example, if the capture city size 9, the next turn after it become stable, I poprush colloseum/University/harbor.
2. You can save a lot of money in unproductive city.
3. You can get high culture points (I am the highest, followed by babylon on other contingent).
The basic rules that I apply (unfortunately, I am playing on CivIII 1.07f, the Conquest game that I just started playing, broke my laptop, and the current laptop just have 128M memory, so back to 1.07f )
1. At least 3 luxs on hand (When I got 3 luxs, I also set the lux slider 10%-20% for poprushing, but when I got 7, I set to 0%)
2. If the city is not hooked up yet, such as on other island, always poprush harbor when the size is 2.
3. Try to poprush that will reduce the pop to 1.
4. If the city size less than 7, I always pop rush (as japanese civs)
1. Library (expensive for japs)
2. temple
3. Cathedral
4. Granary
5. Marketplace (after this, the pop must be higher than 6, for the poprush to be effective, we need marketplace)
6. University
7. Bank
8. Colosseoum.
9. I'm always poprush when the next growth is the next turn, so by the time I poprush, the next turn it adds extra 1 pop)
I read about 20turns, but since I poprushing, I dont keep tracking the last time. I just use the guidelinse above.
By the time I got Theory of Gravity, almost all my city got library, temple, cathedral, university, bank and collo. Only new capture cities or cities on other continent is quit slow (the growth very slow, and probably poprushing is not effective). But once the capture cities on the same continent got all of them. I would switch to communism or if I am lucky, I got leader I just palace-jump.
In my game, 3 of American cities, got flipped , I was leading in culture and tech (hopefully, when I played 1.27f, after adding more memory, wait for my salaries of course , the same technique could be used) How powerful the poprush

[Dry]

Originally posted by binyo66
[...], I am playing on CivIII 1.07f, [...] How powerful the poprush

IIRC, the 1.07f version is the vanilla one (original civ3).
In this version poprush was indeed very powerfull.
The unhappy citizens generated by one poprush were the first to go on the next one. You could go on poprushing like mad without penalties.
From PTW on, (or was it already in some patch?) you have to be carefull with poprush.

[DrSpike]

For goodness sake patch to 1.29!

[binyo66]

I did. But the laptop (256M, P4 2.4GH, Compaq) broke while I was playing conquest (too much harddisk usage for memory swapping). After I got my paycheck, then I would buy more memory then install all the latest to this laptop (currently 126M, P4 2.4G, Compaq). I figure 1.07f is the fastest and dont take much memory

[DrSpike]

There is no difference in the system resources used between the various patches. Vanilla 1.07 will run virtually the same as vanilla 1.29f.

[binyo66]

I am disagree with u. My broken laptop has twice memory than the current one, and it does makes different quite a bit. I actually owned 3 computers. I found out, the latest version is always slower (with all patches been fixed), and in general, its quite true for all kind of software with all new features. For CivIII, the more memory you have the better performance it would be. The other computer I have with 2 CPU(2x1.44G and 512M), run faster running conquest compare to my current laptop (if I look the time taken for a single turn in modern time), since there is no much memory swapping. Unfortunately the graphic is on board and so bad for this kind of game.

[vmxa1]

Well quite a few logic changes went into 1.29f from 1.07. As far as memebory goes the game seems to stay under 400MB, so if you have 512 or 1GB it does not matter. If you have 256MB, then it will suffer some.