about the roman legions

[varus]

i won`t mention anything about the cultural relations between the western civilisation and the roman-greeco civ.
philosophy, arts, architecture ... its obvious to all of us.
but - i want to point your attention to the fact, that there are 1000s of roman constructuctions existing to the present day and some of them even working.

aquaducts supplying fresh water, streets, nearly as good as german autobahnen, bridges, that work perfectly (until blown away like in mostar) etc.

all these building were constructed by legionaries

this fact should have been considered - either by making the romans industrious or by giving the romans legions the capability to build roads ( at industrious worker speed), to chopp wood, to build bridges (if that wasn`t civ3), to build forts and outposts.
a legion, that is stationed in a city should provide one shield per turn, when an aquaduct or colloseum is beeing constructed. (for game balance, the maximum help is one shield, no matter how manny legions you have stationed there).

***

[SIV]

I don't know what the roman legionaries did in your countrey, In my countrey the killed, inslaved and burned cities...

About the game, I thought there was a concept that troops should cost the player mouney (Like in republic) - so there will be a need for a strong econemy.
It's strange to me that large armies will actually be a benefit to your economy.

Even in real history, I believe the legionaries were assigned to build things, not because it's more prodective but rather to have them occupied with something istead of trieng to kill the emperor...

[vmxa1]

Really it is getting very boring to have people keep going about about the traits of a given civ not matching reality.
It is a game, it is not a historical simulation. It does not have to be "real".
If you want to cite all the histry, fine, but do not try to jam it into the game. It is just a game with some sembalance of known history, not a depiction of reality.

[Jaybe]

If you want YOUR legions to build roads, go ahead and enable it in the editor. But understand the AI will not utilize worker functions unless ALL the worker functions are enabled for the unit.

Personally, my legions can build roads and fortifications.

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by SIV
I don't know what the roman legionaries did in your countrey, In my countrey the killed, inslaved and burned cities...
{snip}
Even in real history, I believe the legionaries were assigned to build things, not because it's more prodective but rather to have them occupied with something istead of trieng to kill the emperor...

In my country they did the killing and burning routine, but they built stuff too. eg - there are plenty of straight Roman roads in England, built for swift troop movement for efficient killing, burning and defending. Near Hadrians wall, where mobile defense would have been needed to maintain fortification consistancy, a network of country lanes run straight for miles - rare in England.

I hadn't heard any examples of projects merely to keep ambitious generals busy, but would be interested to hear of them.

btw - Monty Pythons "What have the Romans ever done for us?" scene from 'Life of Brian' springs to mind here.

[Cort Haus]

On the original question - modding a unit or a civ to make it super-powerful is fine if a player wants to do that, but it can unbalance the game and it prevents comparative strategic discussion - if that matters.

Jaybe, I hope you sharply raised the price of your Legions or lowered their stats to balance the mod!

[ChrisiusMaximus]

varus I think you have some good thoughts there but I would imagine that throughout history most nations armies have taken part in construction works of one kind or another, either that or forced their captives into slavery to get the job done. Still though you would always get the job done to a higher standard with skilled trained labour as opposed to forced labour.

In as much as this applies to civ 3 then as pointed out by others it is possible to change aspects of the game you wish to via the editor.

I myself dont bother with mods or with messing with the editor as I cant be bothered to put in the time and I like the game as it is, but if I was inclined I would certainly remember your suggestions and would probably find them an enjoyable new aspect to a game I already enjoy.

Have fun with the editor and keep on civin

[Jaybe]

Jaybe, I hope you sharply raised the price of your Legions or lowered their stats to balance the mod!

When I first added the road/fort abilities to legions, that was it -- but that was soon after the editor came out. I just recently reintroduced the legion changes, but by now MANY things in my game have changed (e.g., MOST slow units have equal attack/defense strengths, but fortifying is +50% defense).

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by Jaybe
... but by now MANY things in my game have changed ... , but fortifying is +50% defense

Ah, Civ 2 nostalgia! Mind you, no taking Inf-defended cities with Cav in your game then

[PLATO]

The legions are already pretty strong. To enhance them you would definately need some sort of balance. UU's already have enough of an advanyage in most cases. The legionaire was a builder, but he was a soldier first and their increased ability in this area fits with history nicely.

[Jaybe]

Originally posted by Cort Haus
Ah, Civ 2 nostalgia! Mind you, no taking Inf-defended cities with Cav in your game then

No, but Rifles can be taken by either cavalry or other RIFLES!
BTW, Rivers are also 50% defense bonus, forests are impassable to wheeled (horse & motorized units are wheeled, of course) ... and mountains -- they are completely impassable!

IOW, it's a rich game.

[ISTANBUL]

Re: about the roman legions

Originally posted by varus
i won`t mention anything about the cultural relations between the western civilisation and the roman-greeco civ.
philosophy, arts, architecture ... its obvious to all of us.
but - i want to point your attention to the fact, that there are 1000s of roman constructuctions existing to the present day and some of them even working.

aquaducts supplying fresh water, streets, nearly as good as german autobahnen, bridges, that work perfectly (until blown away like in mostar) etc.

all these building were constructed by legionaries

this fact should have been considered - either by making the romans industrious or by giving the romans legions the capability to build roads ( at industrious worker speed), to chopp wood, to build bridges (if that wasn`t civ3), to build forts and outposts.
a legion, that is stationed in a city should provide one shield per turn, when an aquaduct or colloseum is beeing constructed. (for game balance, the maximum help is one shield, no matter how manny legions you have stationed there).

***

Ooooh Romans, oooooh Greeks
We owe them everything
Let's alter civ such that either Romans or Greeks win each game, no matter what other civs do

[Panag]

hi ,

some info about the Roman legions , ....

enjoy

http://webpages.charter.net/brueggeman/table-of-contents.html

http://www.romanlegion.com/

http://www.rlqm.com/

http://www.caerleon.net/history/army/

http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_legion

http://www.culturalresources.com/Romleg.html

http://infotech.fanshawec.on.ca/faculty/newell/legion.htm

http://www.art-with-attitude.com/village/roman_legion2.html

http://www.quiknet.com/~fifi/index9.htm

have a nice day

[statusperfect]

Civ3 = Fantasy game. I believe most players want it that way.

[Admiral PJ]

I think Legions come to early in civ3, there needs to be more gap between iron working and bronze. My mod makes more of a gap, maybe not enough still.

The romans were fair to the people they conquered in comparison to other nations at the time, allowing religious freedoms. Its wrong for us to think of them as bad because they were not christian before about 300ad. Many romans were good, and didn't like the barbaric violence of war , I think.
In some ways their empire helped to unite europe and the west, and the resulting Byzantine empire afterwards helped stop the Islamic invasion.
Latin continued to be important to this day, its still used in scientific texts.
The romans advanced mechanical and Civil Engineering and developed Politics and governmental science.